• Cable modem change

    From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to All on Wed Nov 30 01:53:24 2016
    Hello All,

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    So far so good...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Nov 29 21:11:58 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 30 Nov 16 01:53, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to All:

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I now
    have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    So far so good...

    Did you switch providers also then?

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 09:23:08 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    30 Nov 2016 01:53, from Michiel van der Vlist -> All:

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I now
    have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    Great!
    Ziggo??

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Humor is an acronym for "HUman Management Of Reality" (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Nov 30 13:38:27 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 09:23, you wrote to me:

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I
    now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    Great!

    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...

    Ziggo??

    Yes. They are rolling out IPv6, but it is tantalizingly slow. I have been nagging them for over five years. After some failed attempts they finally seemed to get going earlier this year, but after a promising quick rise, it flatttened out again. :(

    http://www.worldipv6launch.org/apps/ipv6week/measurement/images/graphs/Ziggo.png

    Presumable all the CMTSs are ready, the bottle neck is in the CPE.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Bol on Wed Nov 30 13:45:53 2016
    Hello Nick,

    On Tuesday November 29 2016 21:11, you wrote to me:

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I
    now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    So far so good...

    Did you switch providers also then?

    No. Switching provider is not really an option under my conditions here. Ziggo (a subsidiary of Liberty Global) has a monopoly on the green coax cable. DSL is available and the owner of the copper must allow competition. So if I go for DSL I have a choice between an number of providers. Some offer IPv6, some do not. But they all have to make use of the same copper and the cables designed for analog telephony here in the street are well over half a century old. I suspect most of it was laid before I was born. So the DSL providers simply can't match the bandwidth offered by the cable.

    So I just changed the cable modem for a model that supports IPv6.

    It was a bit of a gamble if that would work. Contrary to the DSL providers that allow you to buy and connect your own modem/router, the cable company gives you a modem/router on loan. And those router/modems have customised firmware. Their CMTSa presumably are all IPv6 ready. They have several modem types in circulation but presently only ONE model support IPv6. The Ubee EVW321b. BUT.. they won't give you a particular model if you ask for it. When you get a new modem, they just randomly take one of the shelve. Also, rumour has it that the modesm that have 8 bonded downlink channels are fased out in favour of the newer models that do 16 bonded channels. So the chances of getting an EVW321b via the regular ofiicial channels are slim if not zero.

    As I said, they give you the CPE on loan. The contract states that it has to be returned eventually. With a penalty of EUR 65 for failure. So these modems are not supposed to apeear on the market. Fact is that they do. Aldo they have the legal right to demand return of the ol modes, they often do not insist and customers are requested to dispose of old modems themselves. Also modems get lost because of adminstrative errors.

    So I got myself an EVM321b on "Marktplaats", That is the Dutch "E-Bay". Got it for EUR 15. The guy I got it from said he got a new modem wth a speed uopgrade and they never ask to return the old one.

    This was a bit of a gamble. The first gamble was of course if the modem would work at all. Buying things on the 2nd hand market always carries the risk of buying a led instead of gold.

    The second gamble was if I could get it registered with- and accepted by the cable company. I didn't get it through their official channels. From their POV it is a renegade. Much to my surprise however I managed to register it with the activation codes supplied to me for my previous modem.

    So now I am a happy camper...

    So far so good. It does what I want it to do. I have stable dual stack. But I have already found some quirks.

    To be continued...


    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."

    I left that behind... I am pensioado. ;-)


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20110320
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 07:47:36 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 30 Nov 16 13:45, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Bol:

    So far so good...

    Did you switch providers also then?

    So I just changed the cable modem for a model that supports IPv6.

    Did you know this needed to be done previously? Or did something tip you off that Ziggo was indeed rolling out IPv6 but you were unable to utilize it?

    As I said, they give you the CPE on loan. The contract states that it
    has to be returned eventually. With a penalty of EUR 65 for failure.
    So these modems are not supposed to apeear on the market. Fact is that they do. Aldo they have the legal right to demand return of the ol
    modes, they often do not insist and customers are requested to dispose
    of old modems themselves. Also modems get lost because of
    adminstrative errors.

    Our cable company also goes by this method. Although I do think we're allowed to buy our own modems. With the ease of them providing one for you, you don't ever feel the need to do so until you actually analize your bill and see how much you've paid for the same modem in rent over the last 2-3 years. I could have easily bought and paid for a couple already.

    The second gamble was if I could get it registered with- and accepted
    by the cable company. I didn't get it through their official channels. From their POV it is a renegade. Much to my surprise however I managed
    to register it with the activation codes supplied to me for my
    previous modem.

    Understood. It's pretty surprising that they didn't notice that modem had already been registered by someone else. Even if you used your own activation codes, they should still be able to see by the serial number or something along those lines. That said, the benefit goes to you! :)

    So now I am a happy camper...

    That's what matters in the end.

    So far so good. It does what I want it to do. I have stable dual
    stack. But I have already found some quirks.

    As you will, I'm sure. Sometimes it seems like the people working on introducing IPv6 at the providers know about as much if not less about it than we do. I was told I'd get an email (along with everyone else) letting me know when IPv6 was functional. Well, still no email.. but I've been using native IPv6 for some time already.

    To be continued...

    Most of us aren't going anywhere.

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."

    I left that behind... I am pensioado. ;-)

    While I'm a bit jealous, I would rather pass on that for awhile in trade for age. I have at least another 20 years to go before retirement, and would rather it not happen all that fast. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 16:04:44 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Nov 30 01:53 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to All:

    MvdV> The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I
    MvdV> now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    Congrats!

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 16:06:16 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    Nov 30 13:45 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Bol:

    MvdV> The second gamble was if I could get it registered with- and
    MvdV> accepted by the cable company. I didn't get it through their
    MvdV> official channels. From their POV it is a renegade. Much to my
    MvdV> surprise however I managed to register it with the activation codes
    MvdV> supplied to me for my previous modem.

    Basically the cable modem just needs to support the right DOCSIS version and its MAC has to be activated, i.e. the cable provider puts the MAC into the database and links it to your customer ID. There's no authentication like it's done for DSL (PPP).

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/360.8110 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 17:20:22 2016

    Hello Michiel!

    I now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    :D

    'Tommi

    ---
    * Origin: ================================== (2:221/360.8110)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 16:32:38 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    30 Nov 2016 13:38, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I
    now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.
    Great!
    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...

    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))
    But HE still works great.

    Ziggo??
    Yes. They are rolling out IPv6, but it is tantalizingly slow.
    I have been nagging them for over five years. After some failed
    attempts they finally seemed to get going earlier this year, but after
    a promising quick rise, it flatttened out again. :( http://www.worldipv6launch.org/apps/ipv6week/measurement/images/graphs /Ziggo.png
    Presumable all the CMTSs are ready, the bottle neck is in the CPE.

    Hmmm .. actually slightly going downwards again ... strange.

    Not allways the CPEs (I know of CPEs that have been tested 4 years ago, and that would fully comply, but they are not reconfigured to use IPv6 :( )

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boël on Wed Nov 30 15:51:51 2016
    Hello Nick,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 07:47, you wrote to me:

    So I just changed the cable modem for a model that supports IPv6.

    Did you know this needed to be done previously? Or did something tip
    you off that Ziggo was indeed rolling out IPv6 but you were unable to utilize it?

    Oh, yes I knew it. There is a Dutch internet forum dedicated to Ziggo and there is a Dutch forum for IPv6. Needless to say I participate in both, but mostly in the latter. By comparing notes with other Ziggo customers interested in IPv6 I could follow the rollout quit well. In 2015 they started in a couple of cities with a Cisco modem. The firmaware for the Cisco was quickly rolled back and they switched to the Ubee. The Ubee is still the only one, but we could follow the roll out of the CMTSs. When they got closer to me I knew what I had to look for. I queeried my neighbours. The one next door happened to just have his old Motorola replaced by a Ubee EVM321b and so I asked him if he had IPv6. He had no idea what I was talking about, but he allowed me to push some buttons on his computer and within a minute I confirmed he had IPv6. Then I knew if was time to try to get the same modem. Asking Ziggo was useless, I already found that out, so I started looking on the grey market and within two weeks, I found one for a reasonable price within half an hour ride on the Honda VF750.

    As I said, they give you the CPE on loan. The contract states
    that it has to be returned eventually. With a penalty of EUR 65
    for failure. So these modems are not supposed to apeear on the
    market. Fact is that they do. Aldo they have the legal right to
    demand return of the ol modes, they often do not insist and
    customers are requested to dispose of old modems themselves. Also
    modems get lost because of adminstrative errors.

    Coming to think of it, they never asked me to return my 10+ year old Motorola modem either...

    Our cable company also goes by this method. Although I do think we're allowed to buy our own modems. With the ease of them providing one for you, you don't ever feel the need to do so until you actually analize
    your bill and see how much you've paid for the same modem in rent over
    the last 2-3 years. I could have easily bought and paid for a couple already.

    Here we do not have that choice. There is no rent for the modem specified on the bill. Officially you do not rent it, it is given on loan "for free". I presume this is a legal construction that allows them to force you to use their modem. If they would rent it out for a fee, the customer could refuse.

    In Germany they recently adopted a law that disallowes "zwangsrouter". Meaning that ISPs MUST allow their customers to buy and use their own equipment. I do not know the details, perhaps Markus can tell us more.

    Like you, I would very much prefer the German model. Not just because owning your own stuff usually is cheaper in the long run but also because the stuff from the providers is not all that good. There is much better equipment to be had on the open market. I'd go for a Fritzbox cable modem if I has the choice.

    Unfortunately we do not have a Dutch modem industry that can push a "zawangsrouterverbot" here. In contrast to Germany.

    The second gamble was if I could get it registered with- and
    accepted by the cable company. I didn't get it through their
    official channels. From their POV it is a renegade. Much to my
    surprise however I managed to register it with the activation
    codes supplied to me for my previous modem.

    Understood. It's pretty surprising that they didn't notice that modem
    had already been registered by someone else.

    They can see the MAC, so they should be able to see that it jas been registered before. But they do re-issue refurbished modems, so seeing a previously issued modem turn up at another customer is not an error condition per s.

    So now I am a happy camper...

    That's what matters in the end.

    I do not know if this is the end. This whole thing has been very low key. There has been no official announcement other than what they have been saying for the last five years: "We will roll out IPv6 later this year. The customers will not notice it".

    So... since it is not official, they can roll it back any time. As I mentioned, I have not cancelled my tunnels accounts. The tunnels are dormant, but can be revived when needed...

    So far so good. It does what I want it to do. I have stable dual
    stack. But I have already found some quirks.

    As you will, I'm sure.

    Like that the web interface of the modem is not reaceable via IPv6. So this box is not usable in an IPv6 only environment...

    Sometimes it seems like the people working on introducing IPv6 at the providers know about as much if not less about it than we do. I was
    told I'd get an email (along with everyone else) letting me know when
    IPv6 was functional. Well, still no email.. but I've been using native IPv6 for some time already.

    So.. in your case it is not "official" either. It can go away tomorrow...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Nov 30 17:18:06 2016
    Hi Richard!

    Nov 30 16:32 2016, Richard Menedetter wrote to Michiel Van Der Vlist:

    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...

    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))

    Sorry to say this, but Sixxs are a bunch of morons anyway. When I tried to register for a tunnel, they've rejected my request because in their opinion I got no reliable email address running my own MTAs for longer than Sixxs exists. <facepalm>

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Wed Nov 30 17:52:27 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 16:04, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes.
    MvdV>> I now have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.

    Congrats!

    Thank you.

    The tunnels were good, but I can't help noticing this works better. For one, I now have the full speed. There is no significant speed difference between IPv4 and IPv6. Both the SixXs and the he.net tunnel were significantly slower.

    Also, with the tunnels, when browsing dual stack websites, the connection sometimes fell back to IPv4. I have not seen that happen yet with the now stable IPv6.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/360.8110 to Markus Reschke on Wed Nov 30 19:20:40 2016
    Hello Markus!

    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))

    Sorry to say this, but Sixxs are a bunch of morons anyway.

    My thoughs also.

    When I tried to register for a tunnel, they've rejected my request because in their opinion I got no reliable email address running my
    own MTAs for longer than Sixxs exists. <facepalm>

    When I tried to register for a tunnel, they rejected my request because they could not locate my street address.

    I replied with google maps link.

    They did not answer.

    'Tommi

    ---
    * Origin: ================================== (2:221/360.8110)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Wed Nov 30 21:40:09 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 16:06, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> The second gamble was if I could get it registered with- and
    MvdV>> accepted by the cable company. I didn't get it through their
    MvdV>> official channels. From their POV it is a renegade. Much to my
    MvdV>> surprise however I managed to register it with the activation
    MvdV>> codes supplied to me for my previous modem.

    Basically the cable modem just needs to support the right DOCSIS
    version and its MAC has to be activated, i.e. the cable provider puts
    the MAC into the database and links it to your customer ID. There's no authentication like it's done for DSL (PPP).

    There is a procedure in case the customer lost the activation codes or if the on-line activation procedure fails. Call the helpdesk, give them the MAC and they can manually activate the modem. That is how I figured the MAC is the link between the modem and the customer data base.

    But, as I mentioned these modems have customised firmware. For starters there is the so called Ziggo Hotspot. It allows Ziggo customers to make use of each others WiFi. It is firewalled off from the LAN and the only thing visible is a counter with the number of connected user. The customer can disable it. If you do, you can not use the hostspot of other customers. The other changes may be merely cosmetic, such as displying "Ziggo" on the screens of the weg interface, or they may be morefundamental. Hard to tell. Anyway, I would expect some extra tests to see if it is a modem with the customised firmware or something else.



    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Nov 30 22:02:32 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 16:32, you wrote to me:

    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...

    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))

    Mine is still working but SixXs has stopped accepting requests for new tunnels and Jeroen Massar shows signs of becoming tired of the project, so I think we should not expect much from SixXs any more.

    But HE still works great.

    It may not last forever either...

    http://www.worldipv6launch.org/apps/ipv6week/measurement/images/g
    raphs /Ziggo.png Presumable all the CMTSs are ready, the bottle
    neck is in the CPE.

    Hmmm .. actually slightly going downwards again ... strange.

    Not really considering that there is only one model of modem that supports their IPv6 and that it only provides dfor 8 bonded channel, which is not enough for the highest speed Ziggo offers. (300/30) So if someone upgrades to the highest speed, he/she gets a modem than does 16 bonded channels. But without IPv6. Same when a modems breaks. An asymetric process. When a customer dowgrades to a lower speed, his 16 channel IPv4 only modem is not replaced. Rumour has it that the Ubee is faded out anywy. So when an IPv6 capable modem breaks, chances are it is replaced with an IPv4 only modem. If the pool of outstanding IPv76 modems is not replenished, IPv6 deployment will go down. My guess is that explains the curve ghoing down again. They are not activeley rolling out any more... :(

    Not allways the CPEs (I know of CPEs that have been tested 4 years
    ago, and that would fully comply, but they are not reconfigured to use IPv6 :( )

    I strongly suspect that in this case it is the CPEs...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 17:57:20 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 30 Nov 16 15:51, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boël:

    Coming to think of it, they never asked me to return my 10+ year old Motorola modem either...

    As long as they're not charging you for it. Enjoy your new 10+ year old modem! :)

    Here we do not have that choice. There is no rent for the modem
    specified on the bill. Officially you do not rent it, it is given on
    loan "for free". I presume this is a legal construction that allows
    them to force you to use their modem. If they would rent it out for a
    fee, the customer could refuse.

    Good point. I'm guessing our ISPs here all don't force their equipment then, as they charge monthly for *everything*, including cable set top boxes, routers, any security equipment they offer, etc. I've always had my own router, but never bothered buying a modem yet.

    Like you, I would very much prefer the German model. Not just because owning your own stuff usually is cheaper in the long run but also
    because the stuff from the providers is not all that good. There is
    much better equipment to be had on the open market. I'd go for a
    Fritzbox cable modem if I has the choice.

    I haven't done enough studying on modems to have an opinion on what's good or not. I currently have a Motorola Surfboard SB6141 which seems to have all the bells and whistles I currently need and/or want.

    I would probably have bought a new modem on my own if it were to give considerably better speeds, but I'm currently paying for 50mb/5mb, and speedtest.net reports 60/6.. so I can't really complain. :)

    They can see the MAC, so they should be able to see that it jas been registered before. But they do re-issue refurbished modems, so seeing
    a previously issued modem turn up at another customer is not an error condition per sé.

    That's probably the case, then.

    Like that the web interface of the modem is not reaceable via IPv6. So this box is not usable in an IPv6 only environment...

    Are you trying to connect to your fe80:* address? Or the actual address given by your provider?

    So.. in your case it is not "official" either. It can go away
    tomorrow...

    Exactly. And like you, I have just disabled my he.net tunnel in case anything were to go wrong I won't be without IPv6 for long.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Thu Dec 1 01:33:30 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 17:57, you wrote to me:

    Coming to think of it, they never asked me to return my 10+ year
    old Motorola modem either...

    As long as they're not charging you for it. Enjoy your new 10+ year
    old modem! :)

    You have to send stuff back if theu ask, but it is on their dime. So what they do is, they send you a return box for which the cast of shipping has been paid. All you have to do put the old stuff in the box and hand it in at a "collection point". They only start if you fail to do that.

    But... they only ask to return stuff that they can re-use. That old Motorola is DOCSIS 2.0. The reason that they offered to replace it in the first place it that they want to get rid of the old DOCSIS 2.0 gear. They don;t want it back. If I send it back, not only will they have to pay for the cost of transport, they will also pay for the cost of disposing it in a resposible manner. Here citizens are encouraged to hand in used electric and electronic equipment at a station where it can be recycled/disposed of in a way that does not harm the environment and that allows valuable raw material to be re-used. I can do that for free. Or more precise the removal fee has was already includen in the original purchase. ,But there is no legal oubligation for me to do so. I cab just throw it in the dust bin. But for companies the rules are stricter. The can;t just thow it outm they have to do it by the rules NAD pay for it. So they are never going to as ke me to return my old DOCSIS 2.0 Motorola.

    OK, enough off-topic drift...

    Like you, I would very much prefer the German model. Not just
    because owning your own stuff usually is cheaper in the long run
    but also because the stuff from the providers is not all that
    good. There is much better equipment to be had on the open
    market. I'd go for a Fritzbox cable modem if I has the choice.

    I haven't done enough studying on modems to have an opinion on what's
    good or not. I currently have a Motorola Surfboard SB6141 which seems
    to have all the bells and whistles I currently need and/or want.

    The following comes to mind. I have been assigned a /56. So I can have 256 Iv6 subnets. But... I have not as yet discovered a way to use anything but the first /64 of that assigment with my modem/router. How about you?

    I would probably have bought a new modem on my own if it were to give considerably better speeds, but I'm currently paying for 50mb/5mb, and speedtest.net reports 60/6.. so I can't really complain. :)

    You get that speed on both IPv4 and IPv6?

    Like that the web interface of the modem is not reaceable via
    IPv6. So this box is not usable in an IPv6 only environment...

    Are you trying to connect to your fe80:* address? Or the actual
    address given by your provider?

    I have tried them all. The web interface only responds at IPv4. No big deal. Yet... But of course in future equipment should be manageable via IPv6.

    So.. in your case it is not "official" either. It can go away
    tomorrow...

    Exactly. And like you, I have just disabled my he.net tunnel in case anything were to go wrong I won't be without IPv6 for long.

    Good stategy.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 01:56:38 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 17:18, you wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))

    Sorry to say this, but Sixxs are a bunch of morons anyway.

    Perhaps "bunch" is a bit of an overstatement. As I see it it is just the Head Honcho that has created all these hoops to jump through.

    When I tried to register for a tunnel, they've rejected my request
    because in their opinion I got no reliable email address running my
    own MTAs for longer than Sixxs exists. <facepalm>

    I had no problems when I first registered in 2009. But hen I just used the e-mail address given to me by my ISP. I am mentioned that I was a member of Fidonet and the I intended to promote IPv6 in Fidonet and that got me 50 bonus ISKs.



    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Thu Dec 1 02:02:40 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 19:20, you wrote to Markus Reschke:

    [SixXs]

    When I tried to register for a tunnel, they rejected my request
    because they could not locate my street address.

    I replied with google maps link.

    They did not answer.

    Annoying. Yes, I know, Jeroen Massar is not the ideal son in law. But you have to keep in mid that he has been offering a free service for well over a decade. And it has been a stable and reliable service. For FREE. So lets not be too hard on him. I can understand that he is getting tired of it and is aiming for close down.

    And mind you, he.net does not seem to make you jump through hoops als SixXs does, but that is only for the basic service. Unlike SixXs they have closed certain ports and services. If you want to to run your own mail server, you have to get sage status. So they make you jump through hoops as well. Bigger hoops I'd say.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Nov 30 19:30:00 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 01 Dec 16 01:33, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    The following comes to mind. I have been assigned a /56. So I can have
    256 Iv6 subnets. But... I have not as yet discovered a way to use
    anything but the first /64 of that assigment with my modem/router. How about you?

    I have no idea what my ISP assigned me, though quick searches of the TWC forums seem to mention a /56. But it seems my router is only giving me a /64 as well. Granted, I'm using the "Native" connection type, and also using DHCP-PD. If I disable either one of the two, I am able to input my own data and request different sized prefix lengths. Since I don't really see a reason at the moment to need 256 subnets for less than 20 devices.. I probably won't dive into it much further at this time.

    You get that speed on both IPv4 and IPv6?

    Looks like my IPv6 speed test is a little bit faster. 61.2mb/s (IPv4) vs. 62.5mb/s (IPv6). Not really much of a difference, but looks like I do indeed get that speed on both. This was also tested on ipv6-test.com/speedtest and the nearest testing location for me was in the UK.

    Like that the web interface of the modem is not reaceable via
    IPv6. So this box is not usable in an IPv6 only environment...

    I don't think I've ever even tried this. While my router has it's own IPv6 address, I can't seem to connect to the router's web config via IPv6 either.

    I have tried them all. The web interface only responds at IPv4. No big deal. Yet... But of course in future equipment should be manageable
    via IPv6.

    I'm sure it will. But as long as the router handles dual stack, it's most likely not an issue. If "please.send.me.somewhere.cool" was a viable address, even that could be used to access your router inside your LAN.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/360 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 08:06:07 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote:

    MvdV> [SixXs]

    When I tried to register for a tunnel, they rejected my request
    because they could not locate my street address.

    I replied with google maps link.

    They did not answer.

    MvdV> Annoying. Yes, I know, Jeroen Massar is not the ideal son in law. But
    MvdV> you have to keep in mid that he has been offering a free service for
    MvdV> well over a decade. And it has been a stable and reliable service. For
    MvdV> FREE. So lets not be too hard on him. I can understand that he is
    MvdV> getting tired of it and is aiming for close down.

    Free service or not, he was acting like a moron.

    I checked my emails, this happened in february 2012.

    'Tommi

    --- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:49.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/49
    * Origin: *** nntp://rbb.bbs.fi *** Lake Ylo *** Finland *** (2:221/360)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Thu Dec 1 12:10:05 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Wednesday November 30 2016 19:30, you wrote to me:


    I have no idea what my ISP assigned me,

    I can see it on the setup page of the modem/router:

    Network Configuration

    IPv6 Address: 2001:1c02:1100:fd00:7277:81ff:xxxx:xxxx/64
    IPv6 Prefix: 2001:1c02:1100:fd00::/56
    IPv4 Address: 192.168.178.1
    MAC Address 70:77:xx:xx:xx:xx

    Interface/Prefix
    LAN Delegated Prefix 2001:1c02:1100:fd00::/64

    WAN
    IPv6 Address: fe80::7277:81ff:xxxx:xxxx/64
    2001:1c02:1100:0:815e:4c13:xxxx:xxxx/128
    IPv6 MTU Size: 1500
    IPv4 Address: 83.85.196.65
    MAC Address: 70:77:xx:xx:xx:xx
    Duration D: 07 H: 00 M: 00 S: 00
    Expires: Mon Dec 05 14:23:29 2016

    IPv4 DNS Servers: 89.101.251.228
    89.101.251.229
    IPv6 DNS Servers: 2001:b88:1002::10
    2001:b88:1202::10
    2001:730:3e42:1000::53

    WAN Connection Type: DHCP

    I x't out part of some of the addresses and MACs. The only thing I can change here is the IPv4 local address (192.198.178.1).

    As you can see, the prefix assigned to me is a /56. From the /56, the first /64 is assigned to the LAN by prefix delegation.

    The HTML interface BTW is the only way to access thr outer. No SSH interface...

    though quick searches of the TWC forums seem to mention a /56. But it seems my router is only giving me a /64 as well. Granted, I'm using
    the "Native" connection type, and also using DHCP-PD. If I disable
    either one of the two, I am able to input my own data and request different sized prefix lengths.

    Then you can do more than I can.

    Since I don't really see a reason at the moment to need 256 subnets
    for less than 20 devices.. I probably won't dive into it much further
    at this time.

    Same here and I have less than 10 devices connected. I do not need more han a /64. Presently. I say "presently" because it it IPv4 think. IPv6 was designed to give "end connections" the ability to devide their network into subnets. Subnets that can be isolated and firewalled off from each other.

    What about a guest subnet? You want your guests to have full internet access, but you do not want them in the same subnet as the computer you use for banking do you? And your internet of things.. You want those smart devices in a seperate subnet. Same for your car when it is in dock....


    You get that speed on both IPv4 and IPv6?

    Looks like my IPv6 speed test is a little bit faster. 61.2mb/s (IPv4)
    vs. 62.5mb/s (IPv6). Not really much of a difference, but looks like I
    do indeed get that speed on both. This was also tested on ipv6-test.com/speedtest and the nearest testing location for me was in
    the UK.

    Your provider does not have a speedtest of its own?

    Like that the web interface of the modem is not reaceable via
    IPv6. So this box is not usable in an IPv6 only environment...

    I don't think I've ever even tried this. While my router has it's own
    IPv6 address, I can't seem to connect to the router's web config via
    IPv6 either.

    How about SSH?

    I have tried them all. The web interface only responds at IPv4.
    No big deal. Yet... But of course in future equipment should be
    manageable via IPv6.

    I'm sure it will. But as long as the router handles dual stack, it's
    most likely not an issue.

    Not yet. But it will be an issue in the future. And I don't understand why they didn't make the web interface dual stack right away. HTML over IPv6 isn't rocket science. It is usually easier to do such things right away from scratch than to have to add it later.

    That probably illustrates one of the propblems with IPv6. Lots of developers are still stuck in IPv4 think. IPv6 is added as an afterthought...

    If "please.send.me.somewhere.cool" was a viable address, even that
    could be used to access your router inside your LAN.

    Some might want to access it from outside. (Not me..)


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 12:46:16 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 01 01:33 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    MvdV> The following comes to mind. I have been assigned a /56. So I can
    MvdV> have 256 Iv6 subnets. But... I have not as yet discovered a way to
    MvdV> use anything but the first /64 of that assigment with my
    MvdV> modem/router. How about you?

    PD ;) Try a DHCP client supporting prefix delegation and ask the cable modem/router for a prefix.

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 12:53:28 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    Dec 01 01:56 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Markus Reschke:

    MvdV> I had no problems when I first registered in 2009. But hen I just
    MvdV> used the e-mail address given to me by my ISP. I am mentioned that
    MvdV> I was a member of Fidonet and the I intended to promote IPv6 in
    MvdV> Fidonet and that got me 50 bonus ISKs.

    IIRC, I've also given "Fidonet IPv6 testing" as the reason for the request.

    Cheers,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 13:01:34 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    Dec 01 02:02 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Tommi Koivula:

    MvdV> And mind you, he.net does not seem to make you jump through hoops
    MvdV> als SixXs does, but that is only for the basic service. Unlike
    MvdV> SixXs they have closed certain ports and services. If you want to
    MvdV> to run your own mail server, you have to get sage status. So they
    MvdV> make you jump through hoops as well. Bigger hoops I'd say.

    he.net is fair and reasonable, SixXs is wayward. But it doesn't matter anymore, since the latter doesn't accept any new users. And hopefully everyone will get native IPv6 in the forseeable future.

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 13:07:54 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 01 12:10 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    MvdV> What about a guest subnet? You want your guests to have full
    MvdV> internet access, but you do not want them in the same subnet as the
    MvdV> computer you use for banking do you? And your internet of things..
    MvdV> You want those smart devices in a seperate subnet. Same for your
    MvdV> car when it is in dock....

    Does your cable modem/router got several Ethernet ports or just one? Does it support VLANs? If the answer is "one" and "no", you'll need another router for that.

    BTW, we had those "Zwangsrouter" too for some telcos, but it became history a few months ago. Luckily!

    cu,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Thu Dec 1 13:01:49 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 08:06, you wrote to me:

    Free service or not, he was acting like a moron.

    No argument there.

    The moron has a vaild point though. The big ISPs are too bloody slow! Tunnel brokers like SixXs should have been redundant years ago. Everyone should have native IP6 by now.

    Have you called your ISP? If so what was their response?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 13:42:53 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 13:07, you wrote to me:

    [multiple subnets ]

    Does your cable modem/router got several Ethernet ports or just one?
    Does it support VLANs? If the answer is "one" and "no", you'll need another router for that.

    It has four ethernet ports. But nothing to be found about VLAN. So the answer is not "'one' and 'no'". Do I still need another router. ;-)

    I jave no idea how to deal with a VLAN...

    BTW, we had those "Zwangsrouter" too for some telcos, but it became history a few months ago. Luckily!

    I noticed that you adopted a law against "Zwangsrouter". We have no local modem industry to push the issue... :(


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 14:48:08 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 12:46, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> The following comes to mind. I have been assigned a /56. So I
    MvdV>> can have 256 Iv6 subnets. But... I have not as yet discovered a
    MvdV>> way to use anything but the first /64 of that assigment with my
    MvdV>> modem/router. How about you?

    PD ;) Try a DHCP client supporting prefix delegation and ask the cable modem/router for a prefix.

    Kees made that work with his Fritz. I doubt if it will work with this one.

    I still have my old Linksys WRT54G flashed with OpenWrt laying around somewehere. Does OpenWrt support it?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 14:57:50 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 01 13:42 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Markus Reschke:

    MvdV> It has four ethernet ports. But nothing to be found about VLAN. So
    MvdV> the answer is not "'one' and 'no'". Do I still need another router.
    MvdV> ;-)

    Does the cable modem/router allow to separate a single Ethernet port, i.e. creating an additional LAN?

    MvdV> I jave no idea how to deal with a VLAN...

    So we won't open that can of worms :)

    MvdV> I noticed that you adopted a law against "Zwangsrouter". We have no
    MvdV> local modem industry to push the issue... :(

    There was some support by a few manufacturers, but most pressure came from the public, and there's also EU directive 2008/63/EC.

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 15:37:32 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 01 14:48 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Markus Reschke:

    MvdV> I still have my old Linksys WRT54G flashed with OpenWrt laying
    MvdV> around somewehere. Does OpenWrt support it?

    Yes.

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 1 08:32:16 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 01 Dec 16 12:10, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    I have no idea what my ISP assigned me,

    I can see it on the setup page of the modem/router:

    Network Configuration

    IPv6 Address: 2001:1c02:1100:fd00:7277:81ff:xxxx:xxxx/64
    IPv6 Prefix: 2001:1c02:1100:fd00::/56
    IPv4 Address: 192.168.178.1
    MAC Address 70:77:xx:xx:xx:xx

    Interface/Prefix
    LAN Delegated Prefix 2001:1c02:1100:fd00::/64

    WAN
    IPv6 Address: fe80::7277:81ff:xxxx:xxxx/64
    2001:1c02:1100:0:815e:4c13:xxxx:xxxx/128
    IPv6 MTU Size: 1500
    IPv4 Address: 83.85.196.65
    MAC Address: 70:77:xx:xx:xx:xx
    Duration D: 07 H: 00 M: 00 S: 00
    Expires: Mon Dec 05 14:23:29 2016

    IPv4 DNS Servers: 89.101.251.228
    89.101.251.229
    IPv6 DNS Servers: 2001:b88:1002::10
    2001:b88:1202::10
    2001:730:3e42:1000::53

    WAN Connection Type: DHCP

    I x't out part of some of the addresses and MACs. The only thing I can change here is the IPv4 local address (192.198.178.1).

    My router doesn't even give that much information under the "Native" setting. If I were to do things manually, it would give much more.

    As you can see, the prefix assigned to me is a /56. From the /56, the first /64 is assigned to the LAN by prefix delegation.

    From what I've read on the TWC forums, they assign you a /64, which is what my router shows. However, if you wish to request a /56 you can do it manually.

    The HTML interface BTW is the only way to access thr outer. No SSH interface...

    I can enable SSH to the router (ie: there is settings), but I left that off for now.

    though quick searches of the TWC forums seem to mention a /56.
    But it seems my router is only giving me a /64 as well. Granted,
    I'm using the "Native" connection type, and also using DHCP-PD.
    If I disable either one of the two, I am able to input my own
    data and request different sized prefix lengths.

    Then you can do more than I can.

    Well, this is only theory, as I haven't tried (or had the need) to go any further.

    Since I don't really see a reason at the moment to need 256
    subnets for less than 20 devices.. I probably won't dive into it
    much further at this time.

    Same here and I have less than 10 devices connected. I do not need
    more han a /64. Presently. I say "presently" because it it IPv4 think. IPv6 was designed to give "end connections" the ability to devide
    their network into subnets. Subnets that can be isolated and
    firewalled off from each other.

    What about a guest subnet? You want your guests to have full internet access, but you do not want them in the same subnet as the computer
    you use for banking do you? And your internet of things.. You want
    those smart devices in a seperate subnet. Same for your car when it is
    in dock....

    There are also settings for a "guest network" which I currently have disabled. I don't allow many guests on my network, and the ones I do I know quite well (ie: my sister, who only asks for my password when she's at my house so her wifi works on her phone). However, if I were to set things up that way, I would probably re-flash my router with openwrt which allows for much more manual intervention.

    Your provider does not have a speedtest of its own?

    It does, but it's only IPv4. And doing that test gives me about the same results for IPv4 as the other test did.

    I don't think I've ever even tried this. While my router has it's
    own IPv6 address, I can't seem to connect to the router's web
    config via IPv6 either.

    How about SSH?

    Haven't tried it. So far I haven't had a need to enable SSH as the web interface has everything I've needed so far.

    I'm sure it will. But as long as the router handles dual stack,
    it's most likely not an issue.

    Not yet. But it will be an issue in the future. And I don't understand
    why they didn't make the web interface dual stack right away. HTML
    over IPv6 isn't rocket science. It is usually easier to do such things right away from scratch than to have to add it later.

    I'm not sure what the issue(s) would be in the future. As long as the router itself supports dual stack, it's only a LAN IPv4 address, which wouldn't matter if you actually had functional IPv4 outside your LAN or not. Obviously if you wanted to access your router from outside the LAN (not me), it would present a problem.

    However, I agree that they should have added it all right away. Though it makes me wonder if they're all learning as they go just like us. Implementing one thing and fully testing it, then implementing another and fully testing, etc.

    That probably illustrates one of the propblems with IPv6. Lots of developers are still stuck in IPv4 think. IPv6 is added as an afterthought...

    Hasn't that always been the case (IPv6 being an afterthought)? At the time IPv4 was created, they had no idea they would ever need something more.

    If "please.send.me.somewhere.cool" was a viable address, even
    that could be used to access your router inside your LAN.

    Some might want to access it from outside. (Not me..)

    Agreed. My router would never be open to the public.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 09:00:30 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On 01 Dec 16 12:46, Markus Reschke wrote to Michiel van der Vlist:

    MvdV>> The following comes to mind. I have been assigned a /56. So I
    MvdV>> can have 256 Iv6 subnets. But... I have not as yet discovered a
    MvdV>> way to use anything but the first /64 of that assigment with my
    MvdV>> modem/router. How about you?

    PD ;) Try a DHCP client supporting prefix delegation and ask the cable modem/router for a prefix.

    I think that's exactly what I was referring to. If I disable DHCP-PD on my router, I can indeed ask for a prefix and/or prefix length. I just haven't tried it yet, and don't feel like breaking anything at the moment since everything is working so nicely. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Nicholas Boel on Thu Dec 1 16:36:16 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    Dec 01 09:00 2016, Nicholas Boel wrote to Markus Reschke:

    PD ;) Try a DHCP client supporting prefix delegation and ask the
    cable modem/router for a prefix.

    I think that's exactly what I was referring to. If I disable DHCP-PD
    on my router, I can indeed ask for a prefix and/or prefix length. I
    just haven't tried it yet, and don't feel like breaking anything at
    the moment since everything is working so nicely. :)

    It's a prefix tree. The main router connected to the WAN link uses DHCP PD to request a prefix from the provider. Some routers allow to specify the prefix length. Usually the provider will assign a /56 to your router. After that your router takes the first /64 from that /56 and uses it for its LAN interface. Again, some routers allow to modify the prefix length for the LAN. When you connect another router to your main router, the new router can ask for a prefix via DHCP PD. The main router consults its table and assigns the second /64 out of the provider's /56. This also implies that each router assigning a prefix to another one also takes care about routing the prefix to the correct next hop i.e. the new router.

    Cheers,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 09:57:38 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On 01 Dec 16 16:36, Markus Reschke wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    I think that's exactly what I was referring to. If I disable
    DHCP-PD on my router, I can indeed ask for a prefix and/or prefix
    length. I just haven't tried it yet, and don't feel like breaking
    anything at the moment since everything is working so nicely. :)

    It's a prefix tree. The main router connected to the WAN link uses
    DHCP PD to request a prefix from the provider. Some routers allow to specify the prefix length. Usually the provider will assign a /56 to
    your router. After that your router takes the first /64 from that /56
    and uses it for its LAN interface. Again, some routers allow to modify
    the prefix length for the LAN. When you connect another router to your main router, the new router can ask for a prefix via DHCP PD. The main router consults its table and assigns the second /64 out of the
    provider's /56. This also implies that each router assigning a prefix
    to another one also takes care about routing the prefix to the correct next hop i.e. the new router.

    Thanks for the detailed explanation. That helps me understand the workings quite a bit better. I can only seem to modify the prefix length as well as my LAN IPv6 address if I disable DHCP-PD as far as I can tell.

    Also, I noticed my WAN IPv6 address has a different prefix than my LAN prefix. Which seems like it would fit into the category you're describing, right?

    All of this could probably be done via one router, but it would probably need something more advanced than what they're providing in stock firmware (ie: OpenWRT). With stock firmware, it seems it would be easier to setup different subnets with separate access points or routers added to the mix, which would make for a pretty cool project with a couple extra Raspberry Pi's.

    I have to stop giving myself reasons to buy more of those things. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Nicholas Boel on Thu Dec 1 17:23:42 2016
    Hi Nicholas!

    Dec 01 09:57 2016, Nicholas Boel wrote to Markus Reschke:

    Thanks for the detailed explanation. That helps me understand the workings quite a bit better. I can only seem to modify the prefix

    You're welcome!

    Also, I noticed my WAN IPv6 address has a different prefix than my
    LAN prefix. Which seems like it would fit into the category you're describing, right?

    Yup.

    All of this could probably be done via one router, but it would
    probably need something more advanced than what they're providing in stock firmware (ie: OpenWRT). With stock firmware, it seems it would

    With OpenWrt you can separate Ethernet ports (if supported by hardware) and WLANs, while giving each one its own prefix. This is very useful for things like a guest WLAN.

    be easier to setup different subnets with separate access points or routers added to the mix, which would make for a pretty cool project
    with a couple extra Raspberry Pi's.

    The RasPi is a bad choice for a router, since the LAN is actually USB based.

    cu,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Markus Reschke on Thu Dec 1 13:42:12 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On 01 Dec 16 17:23, Markus Reschke wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    The RasPi is a bad choice for a router, since the LAN is actually USB based.

    Very good point. The RasPi only has an incoming ethernet port, no outgoing.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Fri Dec 2 00:22:12 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 13:01, you wrote to me:

    he.net is fair and reasonable, SixXs is wayward. But it doesn't matter anymore, since the latter doesn't accept any new users.

    Indeed, SixXs has stopped accepting new users and new requests for new tunnels and subnets from existing users. It does not look like a temporary measure. So I think we can forget about SixXs.

    And hopefully everyone will get native IPv6 in the forseeable future.

    I hope so too, but I won't hold my breath. There are still many ISPs that don't even have a plan.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Fri Dec 2 00:16:10 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 14:57, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> It has four ethernet ports. But nothing to be found about VLAN.
    MvdV>> So the answer is not "'one' and 'no'". Do I still need another
    MvdV>> router. ;-)

    Does the cable modem/router allow to separate a single Ethernet port,
    i.e. creating an additional LAN?

    No. Nothing to be found about that in all the menus..

    MvdV>> I jave no idea how to deal with a VLAN...

    So we won't open that can of worms :)

    Better leave that for next year. ;-)

    MvdV>> I noticed that you adopted a law against "Zwangsrouter". We
    MvdV>> have no local modem industry to push the issue... :(

    There was some support by a few manufacturers, but most pressure came
    from the public, and there's also EU directive 2008/63/EC.

    The Germans seem to be more active in these matters than the Dutch. AFAIK, it is not on anyone's agenda. But if there is an EU directive, there is hope...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Fri Dec 2 00:19:05 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 15:37, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> I still have my old Linksys WRT54G flashed with OpenWrt laying
    MvdV>> around somewehere. Does OpenWrt support it?

    Yes.

    OK, I won't throw it away then just yet,


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Fri Dec 2 00:29:24 2016
    Hello Nick,

    On Thursday December 01 2016 08:32, you wrote to me:

    Not yet. But it will be an issue in the future. And I don't
    understand why they didn't make the web interface dual stack
    right away. HTML over IPv6 isn't rocket science. It is usually
    easier to do such things right away from scratch than to have to
    add it later.

    I'm not sure what the issue(s) would be in the future. As long as the router itself supports dual stack, it's only a LAN IPv4 address, which wouldn't matter if you actually had functional IPv4 outside your LAN
    or not. Obviously if you wanted to access your router from outside the
    LAN (not me), it would present a problem.

    There is that, but I was thinking a bit further ahead. Dual stack is not the end goal, it is also a transition mechanism. A sensible engineer does not want to maintain duality forever. On the contrary, once you got the new syetem in place, you want to get rid of the old system ASAP. Keeping two systems in the air side by side increases the effort of maintenace and increases the chanco oe errors. Mars landers and planes have crashed because of using metric and the imperial measures in the same project.

    IPv4 only stuff is an obstacle on the road to IPv6 only.

    That probably illustrates one of the propblems with IPv6. Lots of
    developers are still stuck in IPv4 think. IPv6 is added as an
    afterthought...

    Hasn't that always been the case (IPv6 being an afterthought)? At the
    time IPv4 was created, they had no idea they would ever need something more.

    That was than, but just like the first cars were designed to function is a horseless society, IPv6 was designed to operate in an environment without IPv4.

    If "please.send.me.somewhere.cool" was a viable address, even
    that could be used to access your router inside your LAN.

    Some might want to access it from outside. (Not me..)

    Agreed. My router would never be open to the public.

    "Open to the public" and accesible from outside is not the same thing. YOU may want to access it from outside, but not giving that access to anyone else.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Janne Johansson@2:221/6 to Nicholas Boel on Fri Dec 2 09:38:28 2016
    On 2016-12-01 20:42, Nicholas Boel : Markus Reschke wrote:
    The RasPi is a bad choice for a router, since the LAN is actually USB based.

    Very good point. The RasPi only has an incoming ethernet port, no outgoing.

    That sentence doesn't really make sense.

    It's no problem to run more than one network on top of a single ethernet
    port, either in nasty ways by just overlaying them or
    with VLANs or tunnels. But the issue mentioned first, it being
    on the far end of a USB bus means it will have issues with high
    traffic rates, which makes it somewhat unsuitable for being a
    router on modern networks.

    ---
    * Origin: *** nntp://fidonews.mine.nu *** Finland *** (2:221/6.0)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Fri Dec 2 07:57:42 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 02 Dec 16 00:29, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    There is that, but I was thinking a bit further ahead. Dual stack is
    not the end goal, it is also a transition mechanism. A sensible
    engineer does not want to maintain duality forever. On the contrary,
    once you got the new syetem in place, you want to get rid of the old system ASAP. Keeping two systems in the air side by side increases the effort of maintenace and increases the chanco oe errors. Mars landers
    and planes have crashed because of using metric and the imperial
    measures in the same project.

    You may be thinking much to far ahead (which is not a bad thing). It has taken this long to get IPv6 deployed. I can only imagine how long it's going to take to get rid of IPv4 completely.

    IPv4 only stuff is an obstacle on the road to IPv6 only.

    True. But their thought process probably had something to do with the life expectancy of said router(s) would probably not outlast the transition to full IPv6, and while it's in transition and even completes, the router would still work fine, without extra work put into it.

    You know the routine.. "sell for the highest price possible, but put the least amount of effort into the product" kind of deal.

    That was than, but just like the first cars were designed to function
    is a horseless society, IPv6 was designed to operate in an environment without IPv4.

    True. Albeit I'm sure they've all been brainwashed into the "we've got plenty of time" mindset already.

    Agreed. My router would never be open to the public.

    "Open to the public" and accesible from outside is not the same thing.
    YOU may want to access it from outside, but not giving that access to anyone else.

    I wouldn't want my router accessible from outside whatsoever. Anything I need to do I can do from within my LAN. If my router were to go down while I wasn't home, there's most likely no way of fixing it from there anyways. I would probably need to physically replace or manually reboot it, depending on the issue.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Janne Johansson on Fri Dec 2 08:06:12 2016
    Hello Janne,

    On 02 Dec 16 09:38, Janne Johansson wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    Very good point. The RasPi only has an incoming ethernet port, no
    outgoing.

    That sentence doesn't really make sense.

    Maybe not, but I know what I was saying. My current router has an incoming ethernet port and 4 outgoing ethernet ports. The RasPi only has one ethernet port.

    It's no problem to run more than one network on top of a single
    ethernet port, either in nasty ways by just overlaying them or with

    If you want to run your network "in nasty ways" that's your choice. I choose not to.

    VLANs or tunnels. But the issue mentioned first, it being on the far
    end of a USB bus means it will have issues with high traffic rates,
    which makes it somewhat unsuitable for being a router on modern
    networks.

    What kind of "high traffic rates" and how "modern" of a network are we talking here? If you're on the business end of things, sure maybe so. But for a simple household network with capped internet speeds?

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Nicholas Boel on Fri Dec 2 15:32:16 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    02 Dec 16 08:06, you wrote to Janne Johansson:

    Maybe not, but I know what I was saying. My current router has an incoming ethernet port and 4 outgoing ethernet ports. The RasPi only has one ethernet port.

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That port is
    connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking. Als Linux
    supports VPN and trunking, I use a trunk between the Server and teh Switch,
    the switch is trunked to a second smart switch.

    The second smart switch is located at a position that is convinient for
    a cable modem and a adsl router. The cable modem and the adsl router both have
    their on VPM to the main firewall/router/server. A number of ports on both
    switches serve as endpoint for a third VPN that serves the LAN.

    So the single NIC on the server serves 3 networks, WAN1, WAN2 and LAN.

    At times the server/router functions as secondary router for IPv6. Up to four
    subnets can be requested from the ADSL router, one is assigned to the LAN.

    Apparently I did not transfer all the magic, that is needed for the IPv6
    subnet to the starup scripts. I recently had to shut the system down after
    an uptime of some 2 years, the IPv6 subnet did nor resurface. I will look into
    that again when time comes.

    I have used a Pi as a router in my motorhome. A power-Wifi or a 3g-dongle
    provide a Wan connection. A small usb Wifi then provides the in-vehicle Wifi.
    Of course the Lan port is also available. This setup can cope with the slow
    speeds of the wan connections. I intend to use a Pi3 next year, then the
    internal Wifi can give the in-vehicle lan.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Fri Dec 2 16:05:33 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Friday December 02 2016 07:57, you wrote to me:

    There is that, but I was thinking a bit further ahead. Dual stack
    is not the end goal, it is also a transition mechanism. A
    sensible engineer does not want to maintain duality forever. On
    the contrary, once you got the new syetem in place, you want to
    get rid of the old system ASAP. Keeping two systems in the air
    [..]

    You may be thinking much to far ahead (which is not a bad thing). It
    has taken this long to get IPv6 deployed. I can only imagine how long
    it's going to take to get rid of IPv4 completely.

    Maybe not as long as you think. Some apparently are already seeing the light when it comes to the advantages of IPv6 only internal networks:

    http://preview.tinyurl.com/hrez4e9

    The IPv6 train is slow in coming on steam. But when it starts gaining momentum, and when we see IPv6 only internal networks, it may accelerate expom\nentially.

    IPv4 only stuff is an obstacle on the road to IPv6 only.

    True. But their thought process probably had something to do with the
    life expectancy of said router(s) would probably not outlast the transition to full IPv6, and while it's in transition and even
    completes, the router would still work fine, without extra work put
    into it.

    And missing the opportunity to gain experience when it is not critical yet. Fixing the roof when the sun shines...

    You know the routine.. "sell for the highest price possible, but put
    the least amount of effort into the product" kind of deal.

    Good short term strategy, but a company that does not invest in the future is heading for a dead end.

    That was than, but just like the first cars were designed to
    function is a horseless society, IPv6 was designed to operate in
    an environment without IPv4.

    True. Albeit I'm sure they've all been brainwashed into the "we've got plenty of time" mindset already.

    I think at least some are coming to see the light. It may be different in your part of the world, but here it is very difficult for small companies to get IPv4 address space. The industry is reaaly starting to feek the pain of IPv4 exhaustion.

    Agreed. My router would never be open to the public.

    "Open to the public" and accesible from outside is not the same
    thing. YOU may want to access it from outside, but not giving
    that access to anyone else.

    I wouldn't want my router accessible from outside whatsoever. Anything
    I need to do I can do from within my LAN.

    Same for me, but not everyone is in that position. We have sysops here who only have physical access to their systems in the weekend. OTOH, there are pensionados who are gone for a couple of month in the summer. Roaming the world in a camper, or playing with boats..

    If my router were to go down while I wasn't home, there's most
    likely no way of fixing it from there anyways.

    You do not have a neighbour or friend who can push the reset button?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Kees van Eeten on Fri Dec 2 09:45:30 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On 02 Dec 16 15:32, Kees van Eeten wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That
    port is connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking.
    Als Linux supports VPN and trunking, I use a trunk between the Server
    and teh Switch, the switch is trunked to a second smart switch.

    That's 'just a tad' more advanced compared to where I was originally going with this discussion. :)

    I have used a Pi as a router in my motorhome. A power-Wifi or a
    3g-dongle provide a Wan connection. A small usb Wifi then provides the in-vehicle Wifi. Of course the Lan port is also available. This setup
    can cope with the slow speeds of the wan connections. I intend to use
    a Pi3 next year, then the internal Wifi can give the in-vehicle lan.

    And that's all I was getting at. It is indeed possible. And as long as your USB transfers faster than your internet connection, there is really no bottleneck either.

    Some people in residential areas are capped with internet speeds at 3mb/s or 6mb/s, which is lower than what USB2.0 can transfer at. So my point was that it is definitely possible (while not bogging anything down) in a small scale home hobby network.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Fri Dec 2 09:52:44 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 02 Dec 16 16:05, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    You may be thinking much to far ahead (which is not a bad thing).
    It has taken this long to get IPv6 deployed. I can only imagine
    how long it's going to take to get rid of IPv4 completely.

    Maybe not as long as you think. Some apparently are already seeing the light when it comes to the advantages of IPv6 only internal networks:

    http://preview.tinyurl.com/hrez4e9

    The IPv6 train is slow in coming on steam. But when it starts gaining momentum, and when we see IPv6 only internal networks, it may
    accelerate expom\nentially.

    These exact same things were said when IPv6 was first introduced. Even "World IPv6 Day" was what, 4 years ago? It's still not fully implemented yet. So while I am indeed excited about the movement, I'm not going to hold my breath for exponential accelleration. :)

    True. But their thought process probably had something to do with
    the life expectancy of said router(s) would probably not outlast
    the transition to full IPv6, and while it's in transition and
    even completes, the router would still work fine, without extra
    work put into it.

    And missing the opportunity to gain experience when it is not critical yet. Fixing the roof when the sun shines...

    Yep. Unfortunately that's how the world works.

    You know the routine.. "sell for the highest price possible, but
    put the least amount of effort into the product" kind of deal.

    Good short term strategy, but a company that does not invest in the
    future is heading for a dead end.

    Oddly enough, most of the leading brands are still doing it. I'm sure they'll jump on the wagon when they're forced to. That's how it's been so far all these years already. Continue selling your product as long as you can to make as much money as you can, then when forced.. update your product gradually to keep the profit margin large.

    True. Albeit I'm sure they've all been brainwashed into the
    "we've got plenty of time" mindset already.

    I think at least some are coming to see the light. It may be different
    in your part of the world, but here it is very difficult for small companies to get IPv4 address space. The industry is reaaly starting
    to feek the pain of IPv4 exhaustion.

    Sure, those smaller companies are probably the first to deploy newer technologies, while the bigger companies with monopolies hold off until they can not hold off any longer.

    Same for me, but not everyone is in that position. We have sysops here
    who only have physical access to their systems in the weekend. OTOH,
    there are pensionados who are gone for a couple of month in the
    summer. Roaming the world in a camper, or playing with boats..

    There comes a time in everyone's lives where they must make a choice of being a sysop, or continue to enjoy real life. If I were roaming the world in a camper, one of my least worries would be if my router was up or not. It can definitely wait until I get home to fix it - much like how it seems some of these 'pensionados' you refer to choose to do as well. :)

    You do not have a neighbour or friend who can push the reset button?

    Sure. But I probably wouldn't feel a need to call/bother them to drop everything they're doing to push a button on my router/computer.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Markus Reschke on Fri Dec 2 17:26:00 2016
    Hi Markus!

    30 Nov 2016 17:18, from Markus Reschke -> Richard Menedetter:

    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...
    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))
    Sorry to say this, but Sixxs are a bunch of morons anyway.

    Jeroen used to be very passionate, and the idea of Sixxs to decouple the IP resources from the web page and support was a good one.
    But I think he is extremely frustrated about the slow adoption ... but that is not my fault ;))

    Regarding Mail ... yes, they always had strange views on that.

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: retupmoc siht edisni depart m'I pleH (2:310/31)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Fri Dec 2 17:30:04 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    30 Nov 2016 22:02, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    So it seems. But I am not cancelling my tunnel accounts yet...
    Sixxs has done it for me ;)))
    Mine is still working but SixXs has stopped accepting requests for new tunnels

    Indeed ... and they auto disabled my tunnel after a PoP went offline, and refused to reactivate it ...

    and Jeroen Massar shows signs of becoming tired of the
    project, so I think we should not expect much from SixXs any more.

    Indeed

    But HE still works great.
    It may not last forever either...

    I cannot influence it.
    Currently it works, and if it stops, I need to reevaluate.

    Hmmm .. actually slightly going downwards again ... strange.
    Not really considering that there is only one model of modem that
    supports their IPv6 and that it only provides dfor 8 bonded channel,
    which is not enough for the highest speed Ziggo offers. (300/30) So if someone upgrades to the highest speed, he/she gets a modem than does
    16 bonded channels. But without IPv6. Same when a modems breaks.

    Strange ... in Austria they only offer IPv6 capable CPEs since some time now. The only way to avoid DS-Lite is to use an older CPE, which are not offered any more.

    I have a Ubee Bridge with DOCSIS 3.0 and no WiFi.
    If it breaks down I get a new DOCSIS 3.1 CPE with WiFi and no public IPv4 any more ...

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: On Chinese Xmas lights: For indoor or outdoor use only. (2:310/31)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 16:30:00 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote to All <=-

    The cable modem change I did yesterday appears to be a succes. I now
    have stable native IPv6. Dual stack.


    Nice! :)


    ... Where quality is just a word we like to use.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Markus Reschke on Sat Dec 3 16:45:00 2016
    Markus Reschke wrote to Nicholas Boel <=-

    With OpenWrt you can separate Ethernet ports (if supported by hardware) and WLANs, while giving each one its own prefix. This is very useful
    for things like a guest WLAN.

    That would be nice.

    be easier to setup different subnets with separate access points or routers added to the mix, which would make for a pretty cool project
    with a couple extra Raspberry Pi's.

    The RasPi is a bad choice for a router, since the LAN is actually USB based.

    Agree, the Pi's I/O performance is poor. On one occasion, I had to move a file from a netbook with a USB-Ethernet adapter to a Pi. Later, I downloaded the file from the Pi, but at 3MB/s, instead of the normal 10+ (i.e. close to the full 100 Mbps) that the netbook's USB betwork card can do.

    The Pi is an awesome piece of kit for the price, I love them, but high performance I/O is not one of its strengths.


    ... "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness.'"
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 16:59:00 2016
    --- SBBSecho 2.27-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/6 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 09:23:56 2016
    01 Dec 16 13:01, you wrote to me:

    Have you called your ISP? If so what was their response?

    I asked once. The answer was something like "and how would it make your life better with the ipv6 support in your adsl line?"

    Unfuckingbelievable.

    'Tommi

    ---
    * Origin: 2001:470:1f15:cb0:f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)
  • From Björn Felten@2:203/2 to Tommi Koivula on Sat Dec 3 08:59:07 2016
    :f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)

    I must say that I just love the above. Beautiful!





    ..

    --- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
    * Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Sat Dec 3 11:18:28 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Saturday December 03 2016 09:23, you wrote to me:

    Have you called your ISP? If so what was their response?

    I asked once. The answer was something like "and how would it make
    your life better with the ipv6 support in your adsl line?"

    Unfuckingbelievable.

    Indeed. There is no compettion on the dsl, so you can take your bussines elsewhere?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Sat Dec 3 11:22:13 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Friday December 02 2016 09:52, you wrote to me:

    The IPv6 train is slow in coming on steam. But when it starts
    gaining momentum, and when we see IPv6 only internal networks, it
    may accelerate expom\nentially.

    These exact same things were said when IPv6 was first introduced.

    IPv6 was introduced im 1998, not much publicity was given then.

    Even "World IPv6 Day" was what, 4 years ago?

    First there was "World IPv6 day". That was in june 2011. Followed a yearlater by "IPv6 launch day" on 6 June 2012. Many content providers switched on IPv6 then.

    It's still not fully implemented yet.

    There is progress. I have an add-on intstalled for Firefox that show me when a website is connected over IPv6.

    https://addons.mozilla.org/nl/firefox/addon/ipvfox/

    I find it encouraging how many content providers already support IPv6.

    So while I am indeed excited about the movement, I'm not going to hold
    my breath for exponential accelleration. :)

    I am not going to hold my breath either, but I think we will eventually see the train coming on steam. It is unavoidable.

    True. But their thought process probably had something to do
    with the life expectancy of said router(s) would probably not
    outlast the transition to full IPv6, and while it's in
    transition and even completes, the router would still work fine,
    without extra work put into it.

    And missing the opportunity to gain experience when it is not
    critical yet. Fixing the roof when the sun shines...

    Yep. Unfortunately that's how the world works.

    It appears I was wrong. The Ubee modem/router DOES have IPv6 access to its web interface. But... not from a Win Xp system. On my laptop running Win 7, I can access the web interface via the link local address,

    Very odd that that does'nt work with XP...

    I think at least some are coming to see the light. It may be
    different in your part of the world, but here it is very
    difficult for small companies to get IPv4 address space. The
    industry is reaaly starting to feel the pain of IPv4 exhaustion.

    Sure, those smaller companies are probably the first to deploy newer technologies, while the bigger companies with monopolies hold off
    until they can not hold off any longer.

    Not all of the bigger ones and not in all countries. But some of the big ones ARE moving. In the US, Comcast, Verizon and T-Mobile ARE moving:

    http://www.worldipv6launch.org/measurements/




    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Sat Dec 3 15:02:56 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Friday December 02 2016 17:30, you wrote to me:

    Mine is still working but SixXs has stopped accepting requests
    for new tunnels

    Indeed ... and they auto disabled my tunnel after a PoP went offline,
    and refused to reactivate it ...

    Seems to be part of their exit strategy. No new users, no new tunnels and when a POP provider stops, the tunnels running through that POP are terminated.

    and Jeroen Massar shows signs of becoming tired of the
    project, so I think we should not expect much from SixXs any
    more.

    Indeed

    So anyone still depending on a SixXs better start looking for an alternative. I see two in the list of IPv6 capable nodes: Fernando Toledo and Paul Hayton. Better be prepaired guys...

    But HE still works great.

    It may not last forever either...

    I cannot influence it. Currently it works, and if it stops, I need to reevaluate.

    There are 15 nodes in IPV6.IP6 running an he.net tunnel. If he.net were to go as well, that would heva a serious impact on the Fidonet IPv6 vommunity. Fortunately I see no signs of he.net handing in their dinner pail yet...

    Strange ... in Austria they only offer IPv6 capable CPEs since some
    time now. The only way to avoid DS-Lite is to use an older CPE, which
    are not offered any more.

    It would seem then that Austria is ahead of The Netherlands. Perhaps they have even less IPv4 left?

    I have a Ubee Bridge with DOCSIS 3.0 and no WiFi. If it breaks down I
    get a new DOCSIS 3.1 CPE with WiFi and no public IPv4 any more ...

    You can't say you have not been warned.. :)

    Four years ago, RIPE exhausted its IPv4 address pool. For the occasion I wrote an article for Fidonews about the expected consequences for Fidonet. One of the scenarioos was that Fidonet sysop would have to let go of their globally routabel IPv4 address and that they could only accept incoming via IPv6.I will append a copy of the article at the end of this message.

    Running a Fidonet node from a DS-Lite connection might be an interesting challenge. I think by now it would be doable. You can still make outgoing calls and so you can poll your host at regular intervals for netmailand by now there are enough IPv6 capable nodes in the Fidoweb to let you fully participate.

    You may be the first DS-Lite node. ;-)


    Cheers, Michiel

    ==============================================================================
    From : Michiel van der Vlist 2:280/5555 16 Sep 12 18:27:47
    To : Bjrn Felten
    Subj : Snooze article ===============================================================================
    RIPE is out of IPv4 addresses.
    By Michiel van der Vlist, 2:280/5555


    RIPE-NCC (Rseaux IP Europens - Network Coordination Centre) Is the Agency that issues IP addresses for Europe and the Middle East. It is located in Amsterdam, The Netherlands.

    Last Friday, 14 September 2012, they announced they have begun to allocate IPv4 addresses from the last /8 of IPv4 address space that they hold. So contrary to what the title of this article suggests, they have not completely run out yet. The policy for assigning IPv4 address space has changed drastically though. In the past RIPE-NCC members could apply for address space when needed and as much as they needed for the coming months. From now on each member can only get a one time /22 allocation (1024 addresses) if they already have an IPv6 allocation. That's it, no more.

    What it boils down is that except for the one /22, European ISP's will have to make do with whatever IPv4 addresses they still have on the shelve. Will it affect Fidonet? In the long run for sure. When an ISP runs out of IPv4 space, new clients will get a globally unique IPv6 prefix, but regarding IPv4 the following things may happen:

    1) New clients won't get an IPv4 address. Period.
    2) New clients will get an IPv4 adress in the private range e.g 10.x.x.x.
    3) New clients can get a globally unique IPv4 address for an extra fee.

    As for existing customers, they may be allowed to keep an existing IPv4 address. Or if the ISP goes for option 3, existing customers may also have to pay extra or let go of their globally unique address. Time will tell.

    If you are put behind a NAT you can't run a server answering to an IPv4 address. So if you want to continue with Fidonet over IP as a sysop, it has to be over IPv6. Option 3 may not be all that attractive as the fee will probably be quite high. Not so high as to be a problem for a large or medium sized company, but prohibitively high for most indviduals.

    So in the long run Fidonet will have no choice but to go IPv6. How about the short run? We will probably not be in trouble in the immidiate future. It depends on how fast the internet is growing. In Western Europe Internet penetration is high, the majority of households has a wide band connection, so there will be limited growth in that section. In Eastern Europe it may be different. Plus that mobile internet is still booming all over the world. I have two SIM cards from different networks for prepaid mobile internet. One (KPN) gives me globally unique IPv4 address, albeit a dynamic one. The other one (Vodaphone) gives me a private IP address in the 10.x.x.x range. Not much of a problem for me, as I do not plan to run mobile servers and a point system works al right behind NAT.

    Fidonet may not be affected for a long time. Or maybe some of us will be effected quit soon. We just don't know. What we do know is that the times that everyone can have a globally unique IPv4 address are over.


    Michiel van der Vlist, all rights reserved.
    Permission to publish in the FIDONEWS file echo and the FIDONEWS
    discussion echo as originating from 2:2/2




    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Björn Felten on Sat Dec 3 08:32:20 2016
    Hello Björn,

    On 03 Dec 16 08:59, Björn Felten wrote to Tommi Koivula:

    :f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)

    I must say that I just love the above. Beautiful!

    Very easy to do by setting up a static IPv6 address. However, since my ISP issues dynamic IPv6, and it seems at random times my router will all of a sudden end up with a different IPv6 prefix, it was actually harder to maintain that static address due to having to change the prefix in a few more places.

    Without static, when I notice the prefix changes, I have to only change the prefix on my router as well as my DNS provider. With static, I'd have to do the previously mentioned, as well as change 4-6 lines in /etc/netctl/ethernet-static as well. The more you need to edit, the more you seem to forget to edit - keeping things not working until you remember what you forgot to do. :)

    I'm keeping my eye out for an IPv6 DNS updating tool (or possibly make a text based one) that would change everything for me in the dynamic realm at least. But trying to maintain a static IP with dynamic services is kind of a pain.

    It doesn't seem to happen like IPv4 when /only/ my router resets or is rebooted. I've had the same IPv4 address for a couple years now. IPv6 seems to change at random these days, without doing anything to the router. Makes things a little tougher to keep track of, but pretty easy to spot the issue when polls in either direction with you, Tommi, or Michiel are via IPv4.

    Keeps me on my toes, I guess. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 15:50:52 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 03 11:22 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    MvdV> Not all of the bigger ones and not in all countries. But some of
    MvdV> the big ones ARE moving. In the US, Comcast, Verizon and T-Mobile
    MvdV> ARE moving:

    Deutsche Telekom is funny. For consumer DSL with VoIP IPv6 is inclusive. If you got the cheapest business DSL with VoIP (technically the same like the consumer one), you don't get IPv6. And you can't get it as an option for a few bucks more. If you want IPv6, you have to get a more expensive business DSL. It's time that the EU communications regulation enforces that any internet access product has to provide IPv4 and IPv6.

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 08:50:52 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 03 Dec 16 11:22, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    Even "World IPv6 Day" was what, 4 years ago?

    First there was "World IPv6 day". That was in june 2011. Followed a yearlater by "IPv6 launch day" on 6 June 2012. Many content providers switched on IPv6 then.

    Ah yes. I meant the launch day.. but forgot they were two separate things.

    It's still not fully implemented yet.

    There is progress. I have an add-on intstalled for Firefox that show
    me when a website is connected over IPv6.

    https://addons.mozilla.org/nl/firefox/addon/ipvfox/

    I find it encouraging how many content providers already support IPv6.

    I'm gonna snag that up right now, actually. Sounds like fun. [30 seconds go by]

    I dig it. When I hit my own website I get a nice big 6/little 6 display to the right of the address bar. I'll make sure to keep an eye on it while browsing. Thanks for the link! :)

    I am not going to hold my breath either, but I think we will
    eventually see the train coming on steam. It is unavoidable.

    It's definitely unavoidable at some point. But the wait could continue to be quite hefty. I hope not, though.

    Yep. Unfortunately that's how the world works.

    It appears I was wrong. The Ubee modem/router DOES have IPv6 access to
    its web interface. But... not from a Win Xp system. On my laptop
    running Win 7, I can access the web interface via the link local
    address,

    Via the router's link local address, correct? I'll have to try a little harder. I've been quickly testing these things while in reply to you usually, so in other words, not very extensive testing going on. :)

    Did you have to go to the direct link? For example, when I hit "192.168.1.1" it goes to "http://192.168.1.1/Main_Login.asp" or something like that, so did you use "[ipv6 address]/Main_Login.asp"? or did the redirection work properly for you?

    Also, did you have to use brackets around the IPv6 address? I remember this being an issue at one point, but some software seems to not require them.

    Not all of the bigger ones and not in all countries. But some of the
    big ones ARE moving. In the US, Comcast, Verizon and T-Mobile ARE
    moving:

    Sure they are moving, but at turtle speed. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sat Dec 3 09:06:06 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 03 Dec 16 15:02, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    Seems to be part of their exit strategy. No new users, no new tunnels
    and when a POP provider stops, the tunnels running through that POP
    are terminated.

    Is there a difference between how SixXS operated compared to he.net? Meaning, it seems as though he.net makes money on this whole ordeal. They are in fact a DNS provider as well as a hosting facility.

    There are 15 nodes in IPV6.IP6 running an he.net tunnel. If he.net
    were to go as well, that would heva a serious impact on the Fidonet
    IPv6 vommunity. Fortunately I see no signs of he.net handing in their dinner pail yet...

    I thought he.net started out as a DNS provider and hosting facility. With the free IPv6 stuff, it lured many people to leave their current providers and go with he.net. So if that's the case, I can't see he.net going anywhere any time soon either.

    Did SixXS do it this way? If not, and it was always a free service with no income, I can see why the guy got bored with it.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Sat Dec 3 22:37:48 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Saturday December 03 2016 08:32, you wrote to Bjrn Felten:

    I'm keeping my eye out for an IPv6 DNS updating tool (or possibly make
    a text based one) that would change everything for me in the dynamic
    realm at least. But trying to maintain a static IP with dynamic
    services is kind of a pain.

    I may possibly run into the same problem. I too have dynamic addresses. At least on paper. My IPv4 addres does not change unless the WAN side MAC changes or if I let the lease expire. Like yours, it cabn be stable for years.

    The IPv6 may be different. It has not changes since I activited my present modem/router last week. It is a bit too early to tell how stable it will be. A guy on the Dutch IPv6 forum who lives near here and has the same CPE, says his prefix has changed twice in the last six month.

    It doesn't seem to happen like IPv4 when /only/ my router resets or is rebooted.

    He too says, the change happened with no obvious link to something he did.

    He also says he has a script to automatically update the DNS. It is tuned to the API od his DNA provider so it will probably not work for me. Anyway, if it only changes twice a year, automatic update is not high on my lisy of priorities.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Sat Dec 3 22:50:28 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Saturday December 03 2016 15:50, you wrote to me:

    Deutsche Telekom is funny. For consumer DSL with VoIP IPv6 is
    inclusive. If you got the cheapest business DSL with VoIP (technically
    the same like the consumer one), you don't get IPv6. And you can't get
    it as an option for a few bucks more. If you want IPv6, you have to
    get a more expensive business DSL.

    That is weird indeed.

    It's time that the EU communications regulation enforces that any
    internet access product has to provide IPv4 and IPv6.

    I'd be in favour of that, but I doubt it will happen any time soon. With the present resistence against "rules from Brussels" the Eu should thread carefully to not overplay their hand, she does not jave much clout anyway. Look how long it took them to do something about the extravagant roaming costs. And /that/ is something the customer feels in his wallet...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Sat Dec 3 23:15:57 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Saturday December 03 2016 08:50, you wrote to me:

    https://addons.mozilla.org/nl/firefox/addon/ipvfox/

    I find it encouraging how many content providers already support
    IPv6.

    I'm gonna snag that up right now, actually. Sounds like fun. [30
    seconds go by]

    I dig it. When I hit my own website I get a nice big 6/little 6
    display to the right of the address bar. I'll make sure to keep an eye
    on it while browsing. Thanks for the link! :)


    When you left click on the big 6, it will give you the IP address of this page plus a list of IP adresses that are associated with link on the page. Green for 6 and red for 4. Ever so often you see a mixture of green and red, indicating that we stiil are a long way from IPv6 only.

    I am not going to hold my breath either, but I think we will
    eventually see the train coming on steam. It is unavoidable.

    It's definitely unavoidable at some point. But the wait could continue
    to be quite hefty. I hope not, though.

    Now that we are beginning to see adoptation percentages way above 50% from some of the big ones, I am getting a bit more optimistic. Of course it helps that after all these years, my patience is finally rewarded and I have native IPv6. :)

    It appears I was wrong. The Ubee modem/router DOES have IPv6
    access to its web interface. But... not from a Win Xp system. On
    my laptop running Win 7, I can access the web interface via the
    link local address,

    Via the router's link local address, correct?

    Yes, the one derived from the LAN side MAC.

    The SLAAC address derived from delegated prefix and the LAN side MAC BTW, also works. Luckily that is not the only way, because that would lead to an interesteing chicken and egg problem in an IPv6 only environment. The get to know that address, you would need to get access to the router's web indetrface first... :-)

    Did you have to go to the direct link? For example, when I hit "192.168.1.1" it goes to "http://192.168.1.1/Main_Login.asp" or
    something like that, so did you use "[ipv6 address]/Main_Login.asp"?
    or did the redirection work properly for you?

    Here it is 182.168.178.1 That gest you directly to the login page.

    Also, did you have to use brackets around the IPv6 address? I remember this being an issue at one point, but some software seems to not
    require them.

    Yes, the brackets are required. They are needed to resolve the ambiguity that arises because the colon is also used as the separator between an address and a port number.

    Also see FRL-1019, FRL-1036, RFC 2732 and RFC 3986.

    Not all of the bigger ones and not in all countries. But some of
    the big ones ARE moving. In the US, Comcast, Verizon and T-Mobile
    ARE moving:

    Sure they are moving, but at turtle speed. :)

    No, some really are moving. Not greased lightning, but not frozen turtle either. Trotting speed I'd say:

    http://www.worldipv6launch.org/apps/ipv6week/measurement/images/graphs/KPN.png

    KPN is the former Dutch incumbent.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boel on Sun Dec 4 00:23:23 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Saturday December 03 2016 09:06, you wrote to me:

    Is there a difference between how SixXS operated compared to he.net? Meaning, it seems as though he.net makes money on this whole ordeal.
    They are in fact a DNS provider as well as a hosting facility.

    Oh yes there is a big difference between Hurrycane Electric (that is what the "he" in "he.net" stands for) and SixXs.

    SixXs is a volunteer operation. I vaguely remember there was second man involved, a Dutchman? But now it is basically a one man show. That one man being Jeroen Massar. SixXs is not a provider, it is just an intermediator between the usres of the tunnels and the sponsors providing the POPs.

    he.net OTOH, is a part of Hurrycane electric which is a commercial company running for profit. Their tunnel broket service is just a sideline of their operations.

    There are 15 nodes in IPV6.IP6 running an he.net tunnel. If
    he.net were to go as well, that would heva a serious impact on
    the Fidonet IPv6 vommunity. Fortunately I see no signs of he.net
    handing in their dinner pail yet...

    I thought he.net started out as a DNS provider and hosting facility.
    With the free IPv6 stuff, it lured many people to leave their current providers and go with he.net. So if that's the case, I can't see
    he.net going anywhere any time soon either.

    Hurricane Electric does not seem to go belly up any time soon indeed. But.. they may decide that they have done their share of promoting IPv6 and that providing tunnels for free to everyone is no longer compatible with their bussines model. And so they may pull the plug on that part of their operations.

    Did SixXS do it this way? If not, and it was always a free service
    with no income, I can see why the guy got bored with it.

    SixXs always was a free service. Jeroen Massar put a lot of time and effort in it and that is why I do not want to be too hard on him. Yes, he was not alwasy nice. But I can understand why he got tired of explaining for the umpteemth time how something works to another ignoramus who didn't RTFM. He DID provide a vaulable service to the IPv6 community for over 15 years. And now he got tired of it. It happens...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Björn Felten on Sun Dec 4 10:07:34 2016
    Hi Bjrn.

    03 Dec 16 08:59, you wrote to me:

    :f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)

    I must say that I just love the above. Beautiful!

    Sure. :) Not originally my idea.

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sun Dec 4 10:09:20 2016
    Hi Michiel.

    03 Dec 16 11:18, you wrote to me:

    Have you called your ISP? If so what was their response?

    I asked once. The answer was something like "and how would it make
    your life better with the ipv6 support in your adsl line?"

    Unfuckingbelievable.

    Indeed. There is no compettion on the dsl,

    No. But as stated before, so far I'm happy with the HE tunnel.

    so you can take your bussines elsewhere?

    My business IS elsewhere. <g>

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sun Dec 4 12:32:00 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    Dec 03 22:50 2016, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Markus Reschke:

    MvdV> I'd be in favour of that, but I doubt it will happen any time soon.
    MvdV> With the present resistence against "rules from Brussels" the Eu
    MvdV> should thread carefully to not overplay their hand, she does not

    If the market fails we have to solve the problem by regulation.

    MvdV> jave much clout anyway. Look how long it took them to do something
    MvdV> about the extravagant roaming costs. And /that/ is something the
    MvdV> customer feels in his wallet...

    Not for data. Based on the latest developments roaming costs for data could even increase. The mobile providers got good lobbyists and the politcians forgot about their promises and the EU citizens.

    The US will have fun too with Trump dismantling the FCC. The current situation is already bad, but now it will become more worse.

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Kees Van Eeten on Sun Dec 4 16:10:20 2016
    Hi Kees!

    02 Dec 2016 15:32, from Kees van Eeten -> Nicholas Boel:

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That
    port is connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking.

    VPN or VLAN?

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: A day without sunshine is like night. (2:310/31)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Sun Dec 4 16:34:22 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    03 Dec 2016 15:02, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    Strange ... in Austria they only offer IPv6 capable CPEs since
    some time now. The only way to avoid DS-Lite is to use an older
    CPE, which are not offered any more.
    It would seem then that Austria is ahead of The Netherlands.
    Perhaps they have even less IPv4 left?

    I do not think so.

    The same company has made their CPE config on xDSL IPv6 ready, but never activated it on xDSL.

    The Telco incumbent does not offer IPv6 for residential at all ...
    (they made a IPv6 config 4 years ago, but did not roll it out until now.

    You may be the first DS-Lite node. ;-)

    Not if I can evade it ;)

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Jury: group chosen to decide who has the best lawyer (2:310/31)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Richard Menedetter on Sun Dec 4 16:42:36 2016
    Hello Richard!

    04 Dec 16 16:10, you wrote to me:

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That
    port is connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking.

    VPN or VLAN?

    Sorry, that should be VLAN and VLAN trunking.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Nicholas Boel on Sun Dec 4 17:09:18 2016
    Hi Nicholas!

    03 Dec 2016 09:06, from Nicholas Boel -> Michiel van der Vlist:

    Is there a difference between how SixXS operated compared to he.net?

    HE is operated by a company.
    Sixxs is a non profit.

    Meaning, it seems as though he.net makes money on this whole ordeal.
    They are in fact a DNS provider as well as a hosting facility.

    They do not make money on the tunneling or the free DNS service.
    They just gain reputation.

    Did SixXS do it this way? If not, and it was always a free service
    with no income, I can see why the guy got bored with it.

    It was always a free service.

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: A little truth helps the lie go down (2:310/31)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Michiel van der Vlist on Sun Dec 4 11:09:06 2016
    Hello Michiel,

    On 03 Dec 16 22:37, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    The IPv6 may be different. It has not changes since I activited my
    present modem/router last week. It is a bit too early to tell how
    stable it will be. A guy on the Dutch IPv6 forum who lives near here
    and has the same CPE, says his prefix has changed twice in the last
    six month.

    I've had it change on me twice in two weeks, and now this time around it hasn't changed in almost a month. So I'm unsure as to whether they're still messing around with stuff on their end (most likely), or why it's changing at completely random intervals yet.

    He too says, the change happened with no obvious link to something he
    did.

    He also says he has a script to automatically update the DNS. It is
    tuned to the API od his DNA provider so it will probably not work for
    me. Anyway, if it only changes twice a year, automatic update is not
    high on my lisy of priorities.

    It's not aggrivating yet, so I'll stick with what I'm doing currently. If things get more stable, I may go back to using the fancy static fido IPv6 address. But as long as my prefix keeps changing at random, I'd rather just stick with the dynamic setup and have to manually update less things when the need arises.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Sun Dec 4 22:12:46 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Sunday December 04 2016 10:09, you wrote to me:

    Indeed. There is no compettion on the dsl,

    No. But as stated before, so far I'm happy with the HE tunnel.

    Good for you...

    so you can take your bussines elsewhere?

    My business IS elsewhere. <g>

    How about taking your hobby elsewhere? <g>


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Markus Reschke on Sun Dec 4 22:14:24 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On Sunday December 04 2016 12:32, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> I'd be in favour of that, but I doubt it will happen any time
    MvdV>> soon. With the present resistence against "rules from Brussels"
    MvdV>> the EU should thread carefully to not overplay her hand,

    If the market fails we have to solve the problem by regulation.

    I agree in principle. Many things just can not be left to the market alone. But experience shows that the market is very inventive in neutralising regulation... :(

    MvdV>> she does not have much clout anyway. Look how long it took them to
    MvdV>> do something about the extravagant roaming costs. And /that/ is
    MvdV>> something the customer feels in his wallet...

    Not for data. Based on the latest developments roaming costs for data could even increase.

    I hear contradicting stories.

    The mobile providers got good lobbyists and the
    politcians forgot about their promises and the EU citizens.

    Which illustrates what I just said: the EU not not have much clout when it comes to regulating Telecom. I doubt the EU is able to force the providers to roll out IPv6...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Sun Dec 4 22:29:01 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Sunday December 04 2016 16:34, you wrote to me:

    Strange ... in Austria they only offer IPv6 capable CPEs since
    some time now. The only way to avoid DS-Lite is to use an older
    CPE, which are not offered any more.

    It would seem then that Austria is ahead of The Netherlands.
    Perhaps they have even less IPv4 left?

    I do not think so.

    The same company has made their CPE config on xDSL IPv6 ready, but
    never activated it on xDSL.

    Maybe because these "IPv6 ready" CPEs were not as ready as was claimed after all? Here several IPSs have made a false start because they ran into problems with IPv6 anabled on the CPE. So it was quickly rolled back.

    The Telco incumbent does not offer IPv6 for residential at all ...
    (they made a IPv6 config 4 years ago, but did not roll it out until
    now.

    Hmmm...

    You may be the first DS-Lite node. ;-)

    Not if I can evade it ;)

    Do they have "zwangsrouter" in Austria? If so, you may not be in a position to avoid it..

    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Sun Dec 4 23:13:34 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    04 Dec 2016 22:29, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    The same company has made their CPE config on xDSL IPv6 ready,
    but never activated it on xDSL.
    Maybe because these "IPv6 ready" CPEs were not as ready as was claimed after all? Here several IPSs have made a false start because they ran
    into problems with IPv6 anabled on the CPE. So it was quickly rolled
    back.

    First tests did not show any issues.
    But it was never rolled out excpet a small trial group, so it may be possible that some issues lurked there.

    You may be the first DS-Lite node. ;-)
    Not if I can evade it ;)
    Do they have "zwangsrouter" in Austria?
    If so, you may not be in a position to avoid it..

    Yes.
    The cable the router is owned by the Telco.
    Same with xDSL, but there you get the user/pass to use a different CPE.
    (For vectoring enabled VDSL2 lines you need to use the whitelisted CPE).

    In both cases you can use a router behind the CPE.
    (Bridge mode in cable and "Singleuser" in xDSL)

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: DOS means never having to live hand-to-mouse (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Nicholas Boël on Sun Dec 4 23:07:37 2016
    Hello Nicholas,

    On Sunday December 04 2016 11:09, you wrote to me:

    The IPv6 may be different. It has not changed since I activited
    my present modem/router last week. It is a bit too early to tell
    how stable it will be. A guy on the Dutch IPv6 forum who lives
    near here and has the same CPE, says his prefix has changed twice
    in the last six month.

    I've had it change on me twice in two weeks, and now this time around
    it hasn't changed in almost a month.

    Once a week would certainly be an incentive to start looking for a way to automate it...

    So I'm unsure as to whether they're still messing around with stuff on their end (most likely), or why it's changing at completely random intervals yet.

    Just give it some more time.

    He also says he has a script to automatically update the DNS. It
    is tuned to the API od his DNA provider so it will probably not
    work for me. Anyway, if it only changes twice a year, automatic
    update is not high on my lisy of priorities.

    It's not aggrivating yet, so I'll stick with what I'm doing currently.

    So will I. If t settles down to changing two or three times a year, I can live with it.

    If things get more stable, I may go back to using the fancy static
    fido IPv6 address. But as long as my prefix keeps changing at random,
    I'd rather just stick with the dynamic setup and have to manually
    update less things when the need arises.

    I had the fancy address installed too for a short while. But than I figured using the SLAAC address was easier in case of a prefix change...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Michiel van der Vlist on Mon Dec 5 09:02:08 2016
    Hi Michiel.

    04 Dec 16 22:12, you wrote to me:

    so you can take your bussines elsewhere?

    My business IS elsewhere. <g>

    How about taking your hobby elsewhere? <g>

    Not possible at this geographical location. Well, for a lot of money it could be possible.

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Janne Johansson@2:221/6 to Nicholas Boel on Mon Dec 5 09:54:46 2016
    On 2016-12-02 15:06, Nicholas Boel : Janne Johansson wrote:

    VLANs or tunnels. But the issue mentioned first, it being on the far
    end of a USB bus means it will have issues with high traffic rates, which makes it somewhat unsuitable for being a router on modern networks.

    What kind of "high traffic rates" and how "modern" of a network are we talking here? If you're on the business end of things, sure maybe so.
    But for a simple household network with capped internet speeds?

    I live in .se, so the comes-with-the-housing internet is 100/100, which
    for many practical purposes doesn't feel capped at all, and is likely
    to overwhelm an RPi router.

    Especially if you want to do filtering, nat, shaping or other things to
    the traffic while passing through and not just bilndly passing packets
    over from one port to the next.

    ---
    * Origin: *** nntp://fidonews.mine.nu *** Finland *** (2:221/6.0)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Mon Dec 5 11:52:33 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Monday December 05 2016 09:02, you wrote to me:

    How about taking your hobby elsewhere? <g>

    Not possible at this geographical location. Well, for a lot of money
    it could be possible.

    So the dsl provider has a monopoly. I think a potential competetitor could succesfully claim access to the copper waiving EU rules.

    But that isn't going to help you get IPv6 on your dsl isn't it?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Michiel van der Vlist on Mon Dec 5 13:17:58 2016

    05 Dec 16 11:52, you wrote to me:

    How about taking your hobby elsewhere? <g>

    Not possible at this geographical location. Well, for a lot of money
    it could be possible.

    So the dsl provider has a monopoly. I think a potential competetitor could succesfully claim access to the copper waiving EU rules.

    But that isn't going to help you get IPv6 on your dsl isn't it?

    They have no monopoly, they have to lease the wire if I like order ADSL from another isp, but it will cost much more. Makes no sense.

    I have 5 public IPv4 addresses in the 10/1M ADSL, he.net tunnel speed is exactly the same than ADSL speed.

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Mon Dec 5 13:52:29 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Sunday December 04 2016 23:13, you wrote to me:

    Maybe because these "IPv6 ready" CPEs were not as ready as was
    claimed after all? Here several IPSs have made a false start
    because they ran into problems with IPv6 anabled on the CPE. So
    it was quickly rolled back.

    First tests did not show any issues.

    Not one that was published anyway...

    But it was never rolled out excpet a small trial group, so it may be possible that some issues lurked there.

    Seems plausible.

    Do they have "zwangsrouter" in Austria?
    If so, you may not be in a position to avoid it..

    Yes.
    The cable the router is owned by the Telco.
    Same with xDSL, but there you get the user/pass to use a different
    CPE. (For vectoring enabled VDSL2 lines you need to use the
    whitelisted CPE).

    In both cases you can use a router behind the CPE.
    (Bridge mode in cable and "Singleuser" in xDSL)

    With the cable companies, you can have the modem set in bridge mode and run your own router behind it. But.... IPv4 only. No IPv6 with the modem in bridge...


    Cheers, Michiel


    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Mon Dec 5 14:00:43 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Monday December 05 2016 13:17, you wrote to me:

    I have 5 public IPv4 addresses in the 10/1M ADSL,

    At no extra cost? Do you actually use more than 1?

    he.net tunnel speed is exactly the same than ADSL speed.

    I only got about 50% of the IPv4 speed with my tunnels. Never could figure out why. Now with native IPv6 I have the full speed on IPv6.

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Janne Johansson on Mon Dec 5 09:01:04 2016
    Hello Janne,

    On 05 Dec 16 09:54, Janne Johansson wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    What kind of "high traffic rates" and how "modern" of a network are
    we talking here? If you're on the business end of things, sure maybe
    so. But for a simple household network with capped internet speeds?

    I live in .se, so the comes-with-the-housing internet is 100/100,
    which for many practical purposes doesn't feel capped at all, and is likely to overwhelm an RPi router.

    In your case I definitely agree. However, here in the states there are still 3mb/s / 384k/s speed packages available to people that don't want to pay higher prices for more speed. I would love to have 100/100, but at the moment the highest my ISP goes is 50/5, so that's what I have.

    Especially if you want to do filtering, nat, shaping or other things
    to the traffic while passing through and not just bilndly passing
    packets over from one port to the next.

    Agreed there too. However for a hobbiest with slower internet, it's at least possible. I'm not going to try it, though. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Mon Dec 5 16:19:24 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    05 Dec 2016 13:52, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    First tests did not show any issues.
    Not one that was published anyway...

    I wrote the configuration for the CPE, and was part of the testing team ...
    I would have noticed if there were any issues ;)

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Good day for flying but bad day for landing ... (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Mon Dec 5 16:36:47 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Monday December 05 2016 16:19, you wrote to me:

    First tests did not show any issues.

    Not one that was published anyway...

    I wrote the configuration for the CPE, and was part of the testing
    team ... I would have noticed if there were any issues ;)

    AHA! But then if you were part of the beta team, were you not told why it was discontinued?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Mon Dec 5 17:42:02 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    05 Dec 2016 16:36, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    I wrote the configuration for the CPE, and was part of the
    testing team ... I would have noticed if there were any issues ;)
    AHA! But then if you were part of the beta team, were you not told why
    it was discontinued?

    Nope.

    It was an internal test ... it never was rolled out to real customers.
    Also all employees got IPv6 training, and than nothing followed ...

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: I hate making predictions;especially about the future (2:310/31)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 08:14:00 2016
    -=> Nicholas Boel wrote to Janne Johansson <=-

    In your case I definitely agree. However, here in the states there are still 3mb/s / 384k/s speed packages available to people that don't want
    to pay higher prices for more speed. I would love to have 100/100, but
    at the moment the highest my ISP goes is 50/5, so that's what I have.

    I'm stuck wth 3(roughly)/1 - ADSL on a 4.7k long line for now. The new NBN is under construction here, and when it comes, I will be looking at upgrading to 100/40 (highest speed available)

    Agreed there too. However for a hobbiest with slower internet, it's at least possible. I'm not going to try it, though. :)

    I'd rather load up OpenWRT on a suitable router and use that. :)


    ... If you call me insane again, I'll eat your other eye.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Richard Menedetter on Tue Dec 6 08:21:00 2016
    --- SBBSecho 2.27-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 08:25:00 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Tommi Koivula <=-

    I only got about 50% of the IPv4 speed with my tunnels. Never could figure out why. Now with native IPv6 I have the full speed on IPv6.

    I used to get reasonable speed with tunnels, but horrible latency (PoP being on the other side of the planet). There were local tunnel POPs, but they tended to come and go over the years.

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    I couldn't wait to go native. There were too many issues with tunnels here with latency and/or reliability. I used he.net on a VPS that I had in the US and it was both fast and rock solid there, as the latency in that case was only milliseconds, not 200+.


    ... They don't make antiques like they used to.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Tue Dec 6 01:07:12 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Monday December 05 2016 17:42, you wrote to me:

    AHA! But then if you were part of the beta team, were you not
    told why it was discontinued?

    Nope.

    It was an internal test ... it never was rolled out to real customers. Also all employees got IPv6 training, and than nothing followed ...

    What a waste of time and energy!


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tony Langdon on Tue Dec 6 01:09:48 2016
    Hello Tony,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 08:25, you wrote to me:

    I only got about 50% of the IPv4 speed with my tunnels. Never
    could figure out why. Now with native IPv6 I have the full speed
    on IPv6.

    I used to get reasonable speed with tunnels,

    But your IPv4 speed is a "reasonable" 3/1 Mbps isn't it? My IPv4 speed it 40/4. That is the minmum the cable company has to offer. The high end is 300/30.

    but horrible latency (PoP being on the other side of the planet).
    There were local tunnel POPs, but they tended to come and go over the years.

    We in Western Europe apparently are in a favorite position. I had a choice of a couple of POPs within a 50km radius...

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    I couldn't wait to go native.

    My account with SixXs is eight years old. So I have been waiting eight years for native IPv6. The tunnels were stable and realiable but natibe is noticeably better. Yes I can imagine why you couldn't not wait given the less reliable tunnel services in yourpart of the world.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 09:37:22 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    06 Dec 2016 01:07, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Richard Menedetter:

    It was an internal test ... it never was rolled out to real
    customers. Also all employees got IPv6 training, and than nothing
    followed ...
    What a waste of time and energy!

    Cannot argue with that ...

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: I'm schizophrenic and so am I (2:310/31)
  • From Alexey Vissarionov@2:5020/545 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 11:55:00 2016
    Good ${greeting_time}, Nicholas!

    01 Dec 2016 13:42:12, you wrote to Markus Reschke:

    The RasPi is a bad choice for a router, since the LAN is actually
    USB based.
    Very good point. The RasPi only has an incoming ethernet port, no outgoing.

    Really? :-)

    Any and all ethernet devices are bidirectional. Possibly, you tried to say RPI has only one ethernet device, which could be either WAN or LAN, but that's also wrong, because RPI runs Linux and, therefore, supports 802.1q - so inexpensive switch like DGS-1100-08 would allow you to use up to 7 separate ethernet ports.


    --
    Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
    gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-cmlxxvii-mmxlviii

    ... :wq!
    --- /bin/vi
    * Origin: http://openwall.com/Owl (2:5020/545)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 11:02:34 2016
    05 Dec 16 14:00, you wrote to me:

    I have 5 public IPv4 addresses in the 10/1M ADSL,

    At no extra cost?

    Yes.

    Do you actually use more than 1?

    Of course. :D

    I have a dedicated router for my main he.net tunnel, also a dedicated router for my os/2 bbs.

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    :)

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Alexey Vissarionov@2:5020/545 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 12:00:00 2016
    Good ${greeting_time}, Nicholas!

    02 Dec 2016 08:06:12, you wrote to Janne Johansson:

    Very good point. The RasPi only has an incoming ethernet port, no
    outgoing.
    That sentence doesn't really make sense.
    Maybe not, but I know what I was saying. My current router has an
    incoming ethernet port

    Most people call that "WAN".

    and 4 outgoing ethernet ports.

    Most people call that "LAN".

    The RasPi only has one ethernet port.

    Have a look at BPI-R1. I have one and really like it. https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?CatId=0&isFreeShip=y&SearchText=BPI-R1

    It's no problem to run more than one network on top of a single
    ethernet port, either in nasty ways by just overlaying them
    If you want to run your network "in nasty ways" that's your choice.
    I choose not to.

    So, you may use VLANs then.

    or with VLANs or tunnels. But the issue mentioned first, it being
    on the far end of a USB bus means it will have issues with high
    traffic rates, which makes it somewhat unsuitable for being a
    router on modern networks.
    What kind of "high traffic rates" and how "modern" of a network
    are we talking here? If you're on the business end of things, sure
    maybe so. But for a simple household network

    100 Mbit/s is generally ok, however 1 Gbit/s is much better.

    with capped internet speeds?

    I don't know (and, honestly, don't care) how the internet access speeds are capped in your country and area, but for me the "capped" speed is something in the 10...50 Mbit/s range. That means, even a device for a "simple household network" should support at least 100 Mbit/s.


    --
    Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
    gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-cmlxxvii-mmxlviii

    ... GPG: 8832FE9FA791F7968AC96E4E909DAC45EF3B1FA8 @ hkp://keys.gnupg.net
    --- /bin/vi
    * Origin: http://openwall.com/Owl (2:5020/545)
  • From Alexey Vissarionov@2:5020/545 to Björn Felten on Tue Dec 6 12:37:00 2016
    Good ${greeting_time}, Bjrn!

    03 Dec 2016 08:59:06, you wrote to Tommi Koivula:

    :f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)
    I must say that I just love the above. Beautiful!

    FTS-5004 (http://ftsc.org/docs/fts-5004.001) uses this in all IPv6 examples. And yes, that's the common practice :-)


    --
    Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
    gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-cmlxxvii-mmxlviii

    ... god@universe:~ # cvs up && make world
    --- /bin/vi
    * Origin: http://openwall.com/Owl (2:5020/545)
  • From Alexey Vissarionov@2:5020/545 to Richard Menedetter on Tue Dec 6 12:55:00 2016
    Good ${greeting_time}, Richard!

    04 Dec 2016 16:10:20, you wrote to Kees Van Eeten:

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That
    port is connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking.
    VPN or VLAN?

    VPN on a switch? :-)


    --
    Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
    gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-cmlxxvii-mmxlviii

    ... GPG: 8832FE9FA791F7968AC96E4E909DAC45EF3B1FA8 @ hkp://keys.gnupg.net
    --- /bin/vi
    * Origin: http://openwall.com/Owl (2:5020/545)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Alexey Vissarionov on Tue Dec 6 11:12:10 2016
    Hi Alexey!

    06 Dec 2016 12:55, from Alexey Vissarionov -> Richard Menedetter:

    VPN on a switch? :-)

    Hey ... those are the new smart switches ;)

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: A man isn't poor if he can still laugh (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Tue Dec 6 11:41:07 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 11:02, you wrote to me:

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    ... he.net certified sage

    You went through the effort of getting the T-shirt. So you ARE dedicated to the cause. ;-)

    Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes to indicate who's got the T-shirt?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Alexey Vissarionov@2:5020/545 to Richard Menedetter on Tue Dec 6 13:44:44 2016
    Good ${greeting_time}, Richard!

    06 Dec 2016 11:12:10, you wrote to me:

    VPN on a switch? :-)
    Hey ... those are the new smart switches ;)

    They are not yet smart enough for that :-)


    --
    Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
    gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-cmlxxvii-mmxlviii

    ... GPG: 8832FE9FA791F7968AC96E4E909DAC45EF3B1FA8 @ hkp://keys.gnupg.net
    --- /bin/vi
    * Origin: http://openwall.com/Owl (2:5020/545)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 22:18:00 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    I only got about 50% of the IPv4 speed with my tunnels. Never
    could figure out why. Now with native IPv6 I have the full speed
    on IPv6.

    I used to get reasonable speed with tunnels,

    But your IPv4 speed is a "reasonable" 3/1 Mbps isn't it? My IPv4 speed
    it 40/4. That is the minmum the cable company has to offer. The high
    end is 300/30.

    Different timeframe. I was running cable with initially 10M down, and later, 30M down (IIRC), at a time when DSL here was limited to 1.5M/256k by the telcos. Hopefully I'll be able to get 100/40M Internet in the near future when the net infrasture is completed here. My area is currently under construction.
    Then it's just a phone call or web request to the ISP to get my account switched over to the new infrastructure.

    but horrible latency (PoP being on the other side of the planet).
    There were local tunnel POPs, but they tended to come and go over the years.

    We in Western Europe apparently are in a favorite position. I had a choice of a couple of POPs within a 50km radius...

    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    I couldn't wait to go native.

    My account with SixXs is eight years old. So I have been waiting eight years for native IPv6. The tunnels were stable and realiable but natibe is noticeably better. Yes I can imagine why you couldn't not wait
    given the less reliable tunnel services in yourpart of the world.

    I've had native for over 5 years now. :) FOr the first couple, I had reasonable speeds too, up to 20/1M (DSL was excellent at our previous house).


    ... I either want less corruption, or more chance to participate in it.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/1.1 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 13:43:56 2016
    I have no obsession about getting native IPv6. :D

    You don't have to be obsessed to stand for the cause. :)

    ... he.net certified sage

    You went through the effort of getting the T-shirt. So you ARE dedicated to
    the cause. ;-)

    I just wanted to open the port 25. The t-shirt was an extra bonus. :)

    Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes to indicate who's got the T-shirt?

    :D

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: IPv6 Point at [2001:470:1f15:cb0::4] (2:221/1.1)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 13:57:30 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    06 Dec 16 11:41, you wrote to Tommi Koivula:

    ... he.net certified sage

    MvdV> You went through the effort of getting the T-shirt. So you ARE dedicated
    MvdV> to the cause. ;-)

    MvdV> Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes to
    MvdV> indicate who's got the T-shirt?

    Why not add your complete CV to it.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Alexey Vissarionov on Tue Dec 6 14:00:56 2016
    Hello Alexey!

    06 Dec 16 12:55, you wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    My main firewall/router/server has one Gigabit Ethernet port. That
    port is connected to a switch that supports VPN's and VPN trunking.
    VPN or VLAN?

    VPN on a switch? :-)

    No just vlan on a managed switch, but you knew that, or you did not read the
    whole read the whole message.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Alexey Vissarionov on Tue Dec 6 14:08:18 2016
    Hello Alexey!

    06 Dec 16 12:37, you wrote to Bjrn Felten:

    :f1d0:2:221:6 (2:221/6)
    I must say that I just love the above. Beautiful!

    FTS-5004 (http://ftsc.org/docs/fts-5004.001) uses this in all IPv6 examples. And yes, that's the common practice :-)

    Not so common as we would like, just 6.5 out of 100

    rbb.ath.cx has IPv6 address 2001:470:1f15:cb0:f1d0:2:221:360
    cow.mine.nu has IPv6 address 2001:470:1f15:cb0:f1d0:2:221:6
    fido.ddutch.nl has IPv6 address 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5003
    fido.vlzn.nl has IPv6 address 2001:981:8a54:1:f1d0:2:280:464
    fido.gremlin.ru has IPv6 address 2a01:4f8:131:32aa:f1d0:2:5020:545
    phoenix.bnbbbs.net has IPv6 address 2601:193:c400:6881:f1d0:1:320:219

    edv.ragtime.ru has IPv6 address 2001:470:26:6c0::f257:f1d0

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 14:38:59 2016
    Hi Kees,

    On 2016-12-06 14:08:18, you wrote to Alexey Vissarionov:

    Not so common as we would like, just 6.5 out of 100

    Michiels list has only 50 entries. Does that mean there are another 50 where their host name resolves to an IPv6 address?

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-W32 1.73.8.50-B20161201
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Kees Van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 14:57:16 2016
    Hi Kees!

    06 Dec 2016 14:08, from Kees van Eeten -> Alexey Vissarionov:

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006

    Good idea.
    I will add something like that when I move to vserv.ricsi.priv.at

    Thanx for the idea.

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: I foolproof my programs,but along comes a bigger fool (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Wilfred van Velzen on Tue Dec 6 14:47:21 2016
    Hello Wilfred,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 14:38, you wrote to Kees van Eeten:

    Not so common as we would like, just 6.5 out of 100

    Michiels list has only 50 entries. Does that mean there are another 50 where their host name resolves to an IPv6 address?

    1) Kees makes a list of nodes that flag an AAAA record. Not all of them have a mailer that answers on IPv6. So they do not make it into my list.

    2) I list only one AKA per node. Some IPv6 capable nodes have more then one AKA. So some more of those in Kees' list. do not make it into mine.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Richard Menedetter on Tue Dec 6 15:19:28 2016
    Hi Richard!

    Dec 06 14:57 2016, Richard Menedetter wrote to Kees Van Eeten:

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006

    Good idea.
    I will add something like that when I move to vserv.ricsi.priv.at

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes & SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tommi Koivula on Tue Dec 6 15:10:21 2016
    Hello Tommi,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 13:43, you wrote to me:

    You went through the effort of getting the T-shirt. So you ARE
    dedicated to the cause. ;-)

    I just wanted to open the port 25.

    Because you wanted to run an IPv6 capable mail server. That shows dedication to the cause.

    The t-shirt was an extra bonus. :)

    Good for you! ;-)


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Markus Reschke on Tue Dec 6 15:58:22 2016
    Hello Markus!

    06 Dec 16 15:19, you wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    Good idea.
    I will add something like that when I move to vserv.ricsi.priv.at

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes & SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Can't you use ::f1d0:2:240:1661 or do you prefer to add the point
    address?

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Markus Reschke on Tue Dec 6 08:59:10 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On 06 Dec 16 15:19, Markus Reschke wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes &
    SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    $ ip token set ::f1d0:1:154:10 dev eth0
    RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument

    ..and yes, my device is indeed eth0. If I can get this to work it would make things much easier to maintain, that's for sure.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Markus Reschke on Tue Dec 6 16:13:36 2016
    Hello Markus!

    06 Dec 16 15:19, you wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes & SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Nice, works like a charm. Only the global scope is affected, the link local
    remains to be related to the mac address.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 16:26:36 2016
    Hi Kees!

    Dec 06 15:58 2016, Kees van Eeten wrote to Markus Reschke:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Can't you use ::f1d0:2:240:1661 or do you prefer to add the point address?

    That was just an example ;)

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 16:27:46 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    Dec 06 08:59 2016, Nicholas Boel wrote to Markus Reschke:

    $ ip token set ::f1d0:1:154:10 dev eth0
    RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument

    You need a more recent kernel.

    ciao,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 09:32:44 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On 06 Dec 16 16:13, Kees van Eeten wrote to Markus Reschke:

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes
    & SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Nice, works like a charm. Only the global scope is affected, the link local remains to be related to the mac address.

    Does it stay in effect when you reboot? Or will it have to be added to an init script or startup file of sorts?

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Markus Reschke@2:240/1661 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 16:43:26 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    Dec 06 09:32 2016, Nicholas Boel wrote to Kees van Eeten:

    Does it stay in effect when you reboot? Or will it have to be added
    to an init script or startup file of sorts?

    No, you need to add it to some init script or your network configuration, like /etc/network/interfaces (Debian based distros).

    Regards,
    Markus

    ---
    * Origin: *** theca tabellaria *** (2:240/1661)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 16:32:34 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    06 Dec 16 08:59, you wrote to Markus Reschke:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    $ ip token set ::f1d0:1:154:10 dev eth0
    RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument

    I copied your command string and no error was reported.

    Now I see your problen you were not logged in as root as the $ shows
    at the start of your example.

    ..and yes, my device is indeed eth0. If I can get this to work it
    would
    make things much easier to maintain, that's for sure.

    I have put the following in my /etc/network/interfaces and rebooted.

    ---->8--------
    iface eth0 inet dhcp
    pre-up ip token set ::f1d0:2:280:5006 dev $IFACE
    ---->8----------

    That will only work for Debian type configuration files.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Markus Reschke on Tue Dec 6 09:37:24 2016
    Hello Markus,

    On 06 Dec 16 16:27, Markus Reschke wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    $ ip token set ::f1d0:1:154:10 dev eth0
    RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument

    You need a more recent kernel.

    Thanks for the heads up. It looks like my ArchlinuxARM distribution is still using the LTS 4.4 kernel. So that would explain it. I'll definitely keep this on my TODO as soon as I'm able to do so.

    Is this a permanent command, or do you have to add it somewhere so it re-runs every time you reboot?

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Nicholas Boel on Tue Dec 6 16:54:42 2016
    Hello Nicholas!

    06 Dec 16 09:32, you wrote to me:

    Nice, works like a charm. Only the global scope is affected, the link
    local remains to be related to the mac address.

    Does it stay in effect when you reboot? Or will it have to be added to an init script or startup file of sorts?

    From 'man ip-token'

    ip token set - set an interface token
    set the interface token to the kernel. Once a token is set, it cannot
    be removed from the interface, only overwritten.

    From this I gather, that the value is set in the active kernel, not in
    the image file. So you will have to set the value with your init scripts.

    In my privious message I showed how it can be done on a debian like system.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 16:43:37 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 14:08, you wrote to Alexey Vissarionov:

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006

    + 16:40 [588] call to 2:280/5006@fidonet
    16:40 [588] trying fido6.ddutch.nl [2001:980:42ea:1:ba27:ebff:fe58:d5bb]...
    ? 16:40 [588] connection to 2:280/5006@fidonet failed: {W32 API error
    10065} A socket operation was attempted to an unreachable host


    Not updated the DNS yet?


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 10:25:42 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On 06 Dec 16 16:32, Kees van Eeten wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    $ ip token set ::f1d0:1:154:10 dev eth0
    RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument

    I copied your command string and no error was reported.

    Now I see your problen you were not logged in as root as the $ shows
    at the start of your example.

    I was indeed root. I just typed that out manually since copy/paste wasn't working at the time. I should have used "#" instead. Many apologies. :)

    ..and yes, my device is indeed eth0. If I can get this to work it
    would
    make things much easier to maintain, that's for sure.

    I have put the following in my /etc/network/interfaces and rebooted.

    ---->8--------
    iface eth0 inet dhcp
    pre-up ip token set ::f1d0:2:280:5006 dev $IFACE
    ---->8----------

    That will only work for Debian type configuration files.

    I would just have to create a new file in /etc/netctl/interfaces with something similar. I just wanted to make sure this was needed as I had read elsewhere that changes don't stick after a reboot. Thanks!

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 10:29:24 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On 06 Dec 16 16:54, Kees van Eeten wrote to Nicholas Boel:

    From 'man ip-token'

    From this I gather, that the value is set in the active kernel, not
    in the image file. So you will have to set the value with your init scripts.

    Yep, that among other places I gathered the same information. Just figured I'd ask to verify.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 17:18:20 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    06 Dec 16 16:43, you wrote to me:

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006

    MvdV> + 16:40 [588] call to 2:280/5006@fidonet
    MvdV> 16:40 [588] trying fido6.ddutch.nl
    MvdV> [2001:980:42ea:1:ba27:ebff:fe58:d5bb]... ? 16:40 [588] connection to
    MvdV> 2:280/5006@fidonet failed: {W32 API error
    MvdV> 10065} A socket operation was attempted to an unreachable
    MvdV> host

    Well all three DNS servers give the proper answer, so you will have to wait
    till the caches between your binkd and de nameservers expire.

    I will enable the old address for a few more days.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Markus Reschke on Tue Dec 6 17:41:00 2016
    Hello Markus!

    06 Dec 16 16:26, you wrote to me:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Can't you use ::f1d0:2:240:1661 or do you prefer to add the point
    address?

    That was just an example ;)

    O.K. thanks anyway. I was not aware of the token option. As I move my Pi's
    from DMZ to LAN and back it is quite usefull. I had been looking intoo
    putting the leet text in the mac address, but the ff:fe interferes, so can
    only use the last 2 quadruples.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 17:45:19 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 17:18, you wrote to me:

    MvdV>> + 16:40 [588] call to 2:280/5006@fidonet
    MvdV>> 16:40 [588] trying fido6.ddutch.nl
    MvdV>> [2001:980:42ea:1:ba27:ebff:fe58:d5bb]... ? 16:40 [588]
    MvdV>> connection to
    MvdV>> 2:280/5006@fidonet failed: {W32 API error
    MvdV>> 10065} A socket operation was attempted to an
    MvdV>> unreachable host

    Well all three DNS servers give the proper answer, so you will have
    to wait till the caches between your binkd and de nameservers expire.

    No big deal. I have entered the new IPv6 address in my binkd's config. I can reach you...
    I will enable the old address for a few more days.

    That won't do much good unless you find a way to have 5006 answer to both the old and the new address.

    Don't bother, it is no big deal. The problem will solve itself. Just wanted to know what was going on


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 18:19:16 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    06 Dec 16 17:45, you wrote to me:

    Well all three DNS servers give the proper answer, so you will have
    to wait till the caches between your binkd and de nameservers expire.

    MvdV> No big deal. I have entered the new IPv6 address in my binkd's config. I
    MvdV> can reach you...

    I will enable the old address for a few more days.

    MvdV> That won't do much good unless you find a way to have 5006 answer to
    MvdV> both the old and the new address.

    There is no no magic in adding multiple addresses to an interface in a Linux
    system. An early use, was for virtual websites, so every site had it's
    own IP address.

    MvdV> Don't bother, it is no big deal. The problem will solve itself. Just
    MvdV> wanted to know what was going on

    Well, I have done it anyway.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Kees van Eeten on Tue Dec 6 19:35:43 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 18:19, you wrote to me:

    There is no no magic in adding multiple addresses to an interface in
    a Linux system. An early use, was for virtual websites, so every site
    had it's own IP address.

    It is possible in Windows too, but in my experience only if all the adresses are static.

    MvdV>> Don't bother, it is no big deal. The problem will solve itself.
    MvdV>> Just wanted to know what was going on

    Well, I have done it anyway.

    The problem has already solved itself:

    D:\FIDO\BINKD>ping fido6.ddutch.nl

    Ping fido6.ddutch.nl [2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006] mit 32 Bytes Daten:

    Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=29ms
    Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=26ms
    Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=27ms
    Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=26ms

    Ping-Statistik fr 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006:
    Pakete: Gesendet = 4, Empfangen = 4, Verloren = 0 (0% Verlust),
    Ca. Zeitangaben in Millisek.:
    Minimum = 26ms, Maximum = 29ms, Mittelwert = 27ms



    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Michiel van der Vlist on Tue Dec 6 21:26:44 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    06 Dec 16 19:35, you wrote to me:

    There is no no magic in adding multiple addresses to an interface in
    a Linux system. An early use, was for virtual websites, so every site
    had it's own IP address.

    MvdV> It is possible in Windows too, but in my experience only if all the
    MvdV> adresses are static.

    Yes ofcourse, dhcp can only provide you with one address, if you want to
    add additional ones, they have to be static.

    MvdV> The problem has already solved itself:

    MvdV> D:\FIDO\BINKD>ping fido6.ddutch.nl

    MvdV> Ping fido6.ddutch.nl [2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006] mit 32 Bytes
    MvdV> Daten:

    MvdV> Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=29ms
    MvdV> Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=26ms
    MvdV> Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=27ms
    MvdV> Antwort von 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006: Zeit=26ms

    MvdV> Ping-Statistik fr 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006:
    MvdV> Pakete: Gesendet = 4, Empfangen = 4, Verloren = 0 (0% Verlust),
    MvdV> Ca. Zeitangaben in Millisek.:
    MvdV> Minimum = 26ms, Maximum = 29ms, Mittelwert = 27ms

    Nice, the latency is not too bad.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Wed Dec 7 08:26:00 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Tommi Koivula <=-

    Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes to
    indicate who's got the T-shirt?

    I'd have to change DNS providers to do that. :(


    ... We are never so generous as when giving advice.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Markus Reschke on Wed Dec 7 10:09:32 2016
    Hi Markus!

    06 Dec 2016 15:19, from Markus Reschke -> Richard Menedetter:

    I will add fido6.ddutch.nl as 2001:980:42ea:1:f1d0:2:280:5006
    Good idea.
    I will add something like that when I move to vserv.ricsi.priv.at
    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes &
    SLAAC:
    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Learned something again.
    But I was thinking to add a static :2:310:31 to my static ::1

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Bigamy: one wife to many. Monogamy: same idea (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Kees van Eeten on Wed Dec 7 10:27:44 2016
    Hello Kees,

    On Tuesday December 06 2016 21:26, you wrote to me:

    There is no no magic in adding multiple addresses to an
    interface in a Linux system. An early use, was for virtual
    websites, so every site had it's own IP address.

    MvdV>> It is possible in Windows too, but in my experience only if all
    MvdV>> the adresses are static.

    Yes ofcourse, dhcp can only provide you with one address, if you want
    to add additional ones, they have to be static.

    What I meant is that in Windows one can not have it both. Configuring a static address disables SLAAC and DHCP. One can then configure additional static addresses, but on can not add a static address to the SLAAC address.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Markus Reschke on Wed Dec 7 10:47:46 2016
    Hi Markus!

    06 Dec 2016 15:19, from Markus Reschke -> Richard Menedetter:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Added a static entry, now I only need to move the Fido system there ...
    $ ping6 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31
    PING 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31(2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31) 56 data bytes
    64 bytes from 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=40.2 ms

    Michiel no reason to try just yet, BinkD is not yet configured or started there ...

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Truth, like surgery, may hurt. But it cures (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Tony Langdon on Wed Dec 7 10:31:38 2016
    Hello Tony,

    On Wednesday December 07 2016 08:26, you wrote to me:

    Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes to
    indicate who's got the T-shirt?

    I'd have to change DNS providers to do that. :(

    I don't think so. To participate in the certification project, you need an account with he.net (that's free) and you need an IPv6 connection. But for the IPv6 connection, you do not need to be connected through them.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Michiel Van Der Vlist on Wed Dec 7 11:16:00 2016
    Hi Michiel!

    07 Dec 2016 10:31, from Michiel van der Vlist -> Tony Langdon:

    Perhaps I should add some indicator to the list of IPv6 nodes
    to indicate who's got the T-shirt?
    I'd have to change DNS providers to do that. :(
    I don't think so. To participate in the certification project, you
    need an account with he.net (that's free) and you need an IPv6
    connection. But for the IPv6 connection, you do not need to be
    connected through them.

    And you need (for the later tests) IPv6 reachable nameservers with correct glue record.

    I assumed Tony was referring to that.

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: An expert is someone from out of town (2:310/31)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Dec 7 12:14:12 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Wednesday December 07 2016 10:47, you wrote to Markus Reschke:

    Added a static entry, now I only need to move the Fido system there
    ... $ ping6 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31 PING 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31(2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31) 56 data bytes 64 bytes from 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=40.2 ms

    Michiel no reason to try just yet, BinkD is not yet configured or
    started there ...

    It pings....

    D:\FIDO\BINKD>PING 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31

    Ping wird ausgefhrt fr 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31 mit 32 Bytes Daten:

    Antwort von 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: Zeit=20ms
    Antwort von 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: Zeit=20ms
    Antwort von 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: Zeit=20ms
    Antwort von 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31: Zeit=21ms

    Ping-Statistik fr 2a03:4000:13:1fd:f1d0:2:310:31:
    Pakete: Gesendet = 4, Empfangen = 4, Verloren = 0 (0% Verlust),
    Ca. Zeitangaben in Millisek.:
    Minimum = 20ms, Maximum = 21ms, Mittelwert = 20ms


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Dec 7 13:29:06 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On Wednesday December 07 2016 11:16, you wrote to me:

    And you need (for the later tests) IPv6 reachable nameservers with
    correct glue record.

    I assumed Tony was referring to that.

    AH, yes of course.


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Dec 7 08:15:06 2016
    Hello Richard,

    On 07 Dec 16 11:16, Richard Menedetter wrote to Michiel Van Der Vlist:

    And you need (for the later tests) IPv6 reachable nameservers with
    correct glue record.

    I assumed Tony was referring to that.

    You don't need anything permanent, though. To pass the he.net test all you need is a quick temporary fix - which he.net actually provides (kind of funny, actually). For the final test I just switched my nameservers to the ones he.net provides, ran the test, and switched everything back after it all passed. :)

    As a matter of fact, as long as you somewhat know what you're doing in regards to IPv6, the entire test could probably be spoofed to a point. If you didn't have IPv6 at your location, you could just VNC or SSH to another location that does, and run everything from there. I'm not saying it's the RIGHT thing to do, but it can probably be done.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 8 07:31:00 2016
    Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    I don't think so. To participate in the certification project, you need an account with he.net (that's free) and you need an IPv6 connection.
    But for the IPv6 connection, you do not need to be connected through them.

    I know, it's just the sage level of the test I can't get through. :(


    ... Don't drink and park; accidents cause people.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Richard Menedetter on Thu Dec 8 07:45:00 2016
    Richard Menedetter wrote to Michiel Van Der Vlist <=-

    And you need (for the later tests) IPv6 reachable nameservers with
    correct glue record.

    Yeah, it's just the last one. My DNS provider has IPv6 records, but I am not using my domain in my NS records

    I assumed Tony was referring to that.

    Yep, you got it. :)


    ... Heaven doesn't want me and Hell's afraid I'll stage a takeover!
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Nicholas Boel on Thu Dec 8 07:49:00 2016
    -=> Nicholas Boel wrote to Richard Menedetter <=-

    As a matter of fact, as long as you somewhat know what you're doing in regards to IPv6, the entire test could probably be spoofed to a point.
    If you didn't have IPv6 at your location, you could just VNC or SSH to another location that does, and run everything from there. I'm not
    saying it's the RIGHT thing to do, but it can probably be done.

    I had to setup a special mail server at the time, because I started my tests before Gmail (where my email is) had full IPv6 working, same for my web provider - both issues since resolved). I could switch my test subdomain to he.net, maybe that would work, do a proper delegation. :)
    ... Do you talk to the dial tone much?
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Tony Langdon on Thu Dec 8 10:56:22 2016
    Hi Tony!

    08 Dec 2016 07:31, from Tony Langdon -> Michiel van der Vlist:

    I know, it's just the sage level of the test I can't get through. :(

    What is the problem?
    Just slap postfix and apache2 (or nginx) onto any computer (even a RasPi).

    For the DNS test you can also temporarily change to he.net.

    CU, Ricsi

    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Chocolate isn't a food, it's an anti-depressant! (2:310/31)
  • From Nicholas Boel@1:154/10 to Tony Langdon on Thu Dec 8 09:41:14 2016
    Hello Tony,

    On 08 Dec 16 07:31, Tony Langdon wrote to Michiel van der Vlist:

    I don't think so. To participate in the certification project,
    you need an account with he.net (that's free) and you need an
    IPv6 connection. But for the IPv6 connection, you do not need to
    be connected through them.

    I know, it's just the sage level of the test I can't get through. :(

    Change your DNS provider to use he.net's nameservers temporarily. Then run the sage test again. Once you pass, you can either keep them or go back to your original nameservers. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... "Не знаю. Я здесь только работаю."
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160827
    * Origin: thePharcyde_ distribution system (Wisconsin) (1:154/10)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Richard Menedetter on Fri Dec 9 07:11:00 2016
    Richard Menedetter wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    What is the problem?
    Just slap postfix and apache2 (or nginx) onto any computer (even a
    RasPi).

    Did that for most of the tests, I had an IPv6 only VPS, which did the mail and web tests.

    For the DNS test you can also temporarily change to he.net.

    Have to see if I can manage that without too many issues, I have a lot of RRs in my main domain, which can break things if not properly carried across. The ideal method is to export to zone files and import.


    ... I'm being held prisoner in a chocolate factory. Don't send help.
    --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
    * Origin: Freeway BBS - freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Andrew Leary@1:320/219 to Michiel van der Vlist on Thu Dec 8 18:04:13 2016
    Hello Michiel!

    06 Dec 16 17:45, you wrote to Kees van Eeten:

    That won't do much good unless you find a way to have 5006 answer to
    both the old and the new address.

    You can assign more than one address to the same interface. mbcico answers both the SLAAC address and my custom address here.

    Andrew

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20160322
    * Origin: Phoenix BBS * phoenix.bnbbbs.net (1:320/219)
  • From Michiel van der Vlist@2:280/5555 to Andrew Leary on Fri Dec 9 01:14:30 2016
    Hello Andrew,

    On Thursday December 08 2016 18:04, you wrote to me:

    That won't do much good unless you find a way to have 5006 answer
    to both the old and the new address.

    You can assign more than one address to the same interface. mbcico answers both the SLAAC address and my custom address here.

    Yes, one can assign more than one address to an interface. But as I wrote in another massage, apparently Linux is a bit more flexible than Windows. When I wrote the above I was not aware that in Linux one can have both the SLAAC address and a fixed address.

    My binkd answers to more than one address too. It answers on the SLAAC address and on the PE addresses. But the latter won't do much good.

    In Windows there is no simple way to combine a fancy self choosen host part with a dynamic prefix. Not that I know of...


    Cheers, Michiel

    --- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20130111
    * Origin: he.net certified sage (2:280/5555)
  • From Janne Johansson@2:221/6 to Michiel van der Vlist on Fri Dec 9 09:46:18 2016
    On 2016-12-09 01:14, Michiel van der Vlist : Andrew Leary wrote:

    You can assign more than one address to the same interface. mbcico answers both the SLAAC address and my custom address here.

    Yes, one can assign more than one address to an interface. But as I
    wrote in another massage, apparently Linux is a bit more flexible than Windows. When I wrote the above I was not aware that in Linux one can
    have both the SLAAC address and a fixed address.

    Well, for many OSes, the addition of V6 meant that if not before, now
    you would be forced to handle multiple addresses on the same interface,
    since v4+v6 would always mean two, and if you have any kind of
    configured v6 (slaac or dhcpv6 or manual) you get at least three since
    v6 will always make one of those fe80::, so by that time you would
    probably code it to handle 1,2,3..10 addresses on the same interface the
    same way.

    ---
    * Origin: *** nntp://fidonews.mine.nu *** Finland *** (2:221/6.0)
  • From Tommi Koivula@2:221/360 to All on Fri Apr 10 18:14:24 2020
    Hi All.

    06 Dec 16 15:19:28, Markus Reschke wrote to Richard Menedetter:

    A hint for nodes running linux and dealing with dynamic prefixes &
    SLAAC:

    ip token set ::2:240:1661:0 dev eth0

    Is this possible with netplan?

    I tried it in rpi3 running Ubuntu 18.04.4 LTS...

    Linux 5.3.0-1022-raspi2 #24~18.04.1-Ubuntu SMP Sat Mar 28 00:54:37 UTC 2020 armv7l

    But "RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument". :(

    'Tommi

    ... he.net certified sage
    ---
    * Origin: - rbb.fidonet.fi - Finland - (2:221/360)